Last European production cars with chassis?

[HoTWire]

So the Surfin Safari Squareback thread got me thinking. In these days of BIVA etc. what cars were the last European cars to be running with a separate chassis?

I figure they would be the best ones to consider the late 80's body mod type of stuff on, if you want an easy job of getting it back on the road.

[jrevillug]

The Land Rover Defender is still on a separate chassis.

Otherwise, I suspect you're looking at low-volume stuff: Scimitars and the like. I don't think there were any production cars from Europe on a separate chassis after the Herald/Vitesse/Spit/GT6 - but I could easily be wrong.

EDIT: The Renault 4 has a chassis and was produced until '91. However, I think it relies to an extent on the bodywork to strengthen it, like the Beetle backbone (requires unmodified floorpan).

[MrSpeedy]

Jan 26, 2012 14:27:03 GMT jrevillug said:

The Land Rover Defender is still on a separate chassis.

Otherwise, I suspect you're looking at low-volume stuff: Scimitars and the like. I don't think there were any production cars from Europe on a separate chassis after the Herald/Vitesse/Spit/GT6 - but I could easily be wrong.

I think you're pretty much on it tbh.

Funnily enough, I was just having this conversation.

The only 'moderns' I could think of would be the likes of TVR and Lotus Elise, tho i think you'd be hard pressed to find an economical donor from those stables

Most 4x4s such as Suzuki, Diahatsu etc, but not particularly suited for 'normal' car basis, and you'd probably run into trouble with the 8 point system by the time you've got it sitting right.

[HoTWire]

I wasn't thinking moderns,.. I was literally thinking Herald era, curious exactly when we went to unitary rather than chassis design and what the last few cars would have been ... Forgot about 4x4s

[HoTWire]

Does a floorpan chassis (like Beetles have) count as seperate chassis for purpose of BIVA/IVA in regards to body mods etc.?? That kind of design seemed to live longer than pure separate chassis which seems to disappear in saloons around the mid-late 50's

[mym]

isnt the latest discovery still on a separate chassis, i thought i read/saw a review somewhere saying it was so heavy cos it effectively has 2 chassis

[jrevillug]

Most small cars moved to unitary body with the movement away from the pre-war design in the late 40s/early 50s.

Morris went monocoque in '49 with the Minor.

Ford went monocoque in '53 with the 100e.

The Mini ('59) is monocoque, as is the Imp ('63).

The Hillman Minx moved to a monocoque with the Phase 1 in '39 (production resumed unchanged post-war).

The Herald was very unusual in keeping the chassis, and was, I believe, widely criticized in the motoring press for that reason.

Bigger cars seemed to take a little longer - probably because they weren't big sellers at the time, so the companies concentrated on the booming small car market. For example, the Rover P4 (chassis) was only replaced by the P6 (monocoque) in the early '60s. (As an aside: the P5 ['58, monocoque] wasn't a replacement for the P4: it was bigger and ran alongside both the P4 and P6.)

[composimmonite]

Don't forget the 2CV - production stopped in 1990.
Suzuki made SJ & Vitara's in Spain. I've considered a Vitara (had one last year) without front drive, RWD only gearbox (not sure if SJ / Rascal unit suitable) and lowered ride height as a basis for a special.

Paul H

[jrevillug]

Jan 26, 2012 14:55:39 GMT HoTWire said:

Does a floorpan chassis (like Beetles have) count as seperate chassis for purpose of BIVA/IVA in regards to body mods etc.?? That kind of design seemed to live longer than pure separate chassis which seems to disappear in saloons around the mid-late 50's

I think the Beetle requires both the backbone and the floorpan (both unmodified) - but not the upper bodywork.

I don't know about the 2cv or Renault 4 though - nor do I know what else has something similar.

EDIT: thinking about it, the 2cv 'shell is so flimsy that the chassis must count as a proper chassis by itself. But don't take my assumption as truth.

EDIT2: Some Lotus (Elan, Elite, maybe others?) used a backbone chassis, but I'm fairly sure that the DVLA regards these as linked subframes bolted to a glass monocoque.

[Dez]

the last ones that would be of any great use to us as modders really would be the reliant scimitar, and the taxi. 4x4s and pickups did run chassis loads later, but most are too big/heavy/ugly/unowerable to be of any use. theres two exceptions though, the mazda b2000 one is pretty good (apart from the fact they rot like f-k!) and IIRC is the correct length for some of the 50s yank pickups. the other one is the suzuki SJ- the back half of the chassis is the same width apart and dimensions as a model A ford, except its got a good kickup and a 5 link- you can literally cut if off at the firewall area and weld on some trad front rails for a super cheap A chassis (would still need biva though obvs. ) the rear axle is even the right bolt pattern!

[Autofive]

Jan 26, 2012 15:10:44 GMT jrevillug said:

EDIT2: Some Lotus (Elan, Elite, maybe others?) used a backbone chassis, but I'm fairly sure that the DVLA regards these as linked subframes bolted to a glass monocoque.

yes, lotus bodies carry the v5/vin etc



what about the people carriers?
I'm sure I was told a while back that one them, possibly a citreon or renault, used a GRP body and chassis

[PandaSelecta]

Jan 26, 2012 15:53:35 GMT Autofive said:

what about the people carriers?
I'm sure I was told a while back that one them, possibly a citreon or renault, used a GRP body and chassis

wasnt that the mk1 espace (hence the top gear convertible)

[Deleted]

What about the Reliant robin was made into the 2000's l think

Astons are built on a chassis be it aluminium extrusion glued/bolted together, the outer panels are cosmetic as to save money the crash car's didn't have outer panels.

There are probably other small car companies but to me the last proper volume car with chassis would have to be the TR6 which finished in 1976.

[Joe T]

Morgans?

[dw1603]

Jan 26, 2012 15:47:43 GMT Dez said:

The other one is the suzuki SJ- the back half of the chassis is the same width apart and dimensions as a model A ford, except its got a good kickup and a 5 link- you can literally cut if off at the firewall area and weld on some trad front rails for a super cheap A chassis (would still need biva though obvs. ) the rear axle is even the right bolt pattern!

Thats the kind of info that I love to stash away in the dark recesses of my mind in the vain hope that I might actually use it one day. Another "late model" euro with a seperate chassis was the Wartburg Knight, the later ones even used a Golf engine as the 2 stroke triple was an emmisions disaster. Just a thought, but that would be an ideal basis for the powered caravan project that popped up again recently.

[cossie pop]

FORD RANGER 2WD same as Mazda plenty about now due to LEZ can get a Willys body for them and as said before good for the old trucks

[MWF]

Jan 26, 2012 14:59:06 GMT mym said:

isnt the latest discovery still on a separate chassis, I thought I read/saw a review somewhere saying it was so heavy cos it effectively has 2 chassis

I believe the Disco 3 is as I've heard comments about the body having to be lifted off the chassis to do certain maintenance jobs.

[usedabused]

TVR's have been used to rebuild plenty daft cars yet they run a separate chassis which carries the chassis numbers.

This golf was built on one, curtecy of Golf GTI.co.uk



And I'm sure we all remember this beast??

[doobie]

Not strictly european but the toyota CROWN was built with a seperate chassis up to 1995.....

[arrocuda]

Jan 26, 2012 15:09:02 GMT jrevillug said:

Morris went monocoque in '49 with the Minor.

The minor was a chassis build until it was discontinued around '71 which is why there are so many roof chopped ones around.