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Jul 17, 2012 18:12:56 GMT
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I have had a few cars, and I have a bit of engineering theory in my head. One of the cars that should have been a brilliant steer - 306 gti-6 was down right dangerous on a B road, all due to the lowered suspension and a lack of travel. It would bottom out over bumps and start to pogo and point any which way but straight! I have just done quite a bit of investigation into spring rates, resonant frequency of uprights / McPherson struts and using information provided by friends, tuned the spring rates on the new coilovers for the celica to suit bumpy B roads. The result is fantastic, initially the car was too low (general scraping and catching getting off the drive etc), so it was raised 30mm at the back and 25mm at the front. The ride is firm but compliant, you can feel the bumps but they do not jarr. Overall it is worth putting time into suspension specification, even if you are looking for "Stance", there is no reason to compromise on the ride!
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Jul 17, 2012 18:27:11 GMT
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Overall it is worth putting time into suspension specification, even if you are looking for "Stance", there is no reason to compromise on the ride! I need to find a tame race car engineer to give some advice on this
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MK2VR6
Posted a lot
Mk2 Golf GTi 90 Spec
Posts: 3,328
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Jul 17, 2012 18:51:56 GMT
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Just an observation on 'moderns'. My fiancee used to own a Seat Leon Tdi 110, based on a mk4 Golf/Audi A3 floorpan. Turns out it shares more components with the Audi than it does the VW. # She replaced it with a Mk4 Golf Tdi 130. Both were/are bog standard. The less powerful, older, lower spec model Leon handled waaaay better than the Golf she now owns. My current daily is a 2003 Audi A4 avant TDi 130SE. It's not a sport model and doesn't pretend to be. Does it handle way better than the Golf? Hell yeah! Just proving that when manufacturers 'get it right' in the first place, sometimes the only reason needed for lowering/tweaking is purely aesthetic. As for the Golf, I'm seriously tempted to upgrade the suspension with a 40mm drop on decent springs, combined with decent harder shocks. The reason for this wouldn't be aesthetics, but handling. Hey, the car would look prettier sat 40mm lower too, but that would just be a by-product of the work undertaken. Have a low mk4 Golf
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Last Edit: Jul 17, 2012 18:55:12 GMT by MK2VR6
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Jul 17, 2012 18:59:49 GMT
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Overall it is worth putting time into suspension specification, even if you are looking for "Stance", there is no reason to compromise on the ride! Unless you're going so low that there's only an inch of travel left.
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Jul 17, 2012 19:24:22 GMT
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Even then, you can go that low and engineer the suspension to have travel. Move pivot points, raise strut towers etc. Either way, suspension without travel is no longer suspension - To suspend - to attach so as to allow free movement No travel, no suspension
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Jul 17, 2012 19:34:18 GMT
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Overall it is worth putting time into suspension specification, even if you are looking for "Stance", there is no reason to compromise on the ride! I need to find a tame race car engineer to give some advice on this Unfortunately if you ask my mate for that kind of advise he kind of gets stuck at, "Rip it all out, space frame, wishbones, antidive, antisquat, move the engine back for inboard front shocks" etc etc
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Volvo back as my main squeeze, more boost and some interior goodies on the way.
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Jul 17, 2012 20:18:59 GMT
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I think it's all relative really. You'll always get the "for and "against" in any discussion, the diehards that have their opinion and think everyone else should live by their rules.. I do what I want to my car, I have stretched tyres (nothing too mad, 205/40's on 8.5's), camber and low coilovers. My car is a daily that mostly gets driven on crappy, bumpy B roads. The ride is hard but the suspension still has travel. I usually stick to 60mph, not because my car handles wibblepoo but because I don't feel the need to go faster most of the time. Every now and then I'll give it the beans and it doesn't handle any differently now than it did when it was high/"proper" tyres/no camber. Perhaps on a track the limit of the tyres would be found before the original setup. I'll never find out, I've had enough bad experiences/lost friends in my life to not want to drive like a d*ck on public roads..
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Jul 17, 2012 20:26:19 GMT
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Unfortunately if you ask my mate for that kind of advise he kind of gets stuck at, Rip it all out, space frame, wishbones, antidive, antisquat, move the engine back for inboard front shocks" etc etc Do you know me? And Stu, you should be able to enjoy a good handling car at any speed, you don't need grip to have good handling, as said earlier, hell, the feedback my 306 gives can make me grin just nipping to the shops.
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Last Edit: Jul 17, 2012 20:27:39 GMT by phillipm
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Jul 17, 2012 20:36:39 GMT
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I loved how my 306 Cabriolet handled. It was great fun, and very predictable, controllable. Wouldn't have wanted to mess with it in any way - but I had it from new. A ten year old bouncy tired one, I'd feel very differently about I expect.
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Jul 17, 2012 20:37:59 GMT
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[quote author=phillipm board=techni thread=133132 post=1619139 time=1342556779 And Stu, you should be able to enjoy a good handling car at any speed, you don't need grip to have good handling, as said earlier, hell, the feedback my 306 gives can make me grin just nipping to the shops.[/quote] Miss my old Dturbo, cheap times!
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Jul 17, 2012 20:48:52 GMT
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Serves you right for buying a Bavarian money-pit
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Jul 17, 2012 20:57:44 GMT
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Serves you right for buying a Bavarian money-pit ;D Haha! It's still more comfy even with the 100mm drop. Plus the electrics work nearly all the time. Also, less bits seem to fall off than the pug (big speed bumps excepted..!)
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Jul 17, 2012 21:06:51 GMT
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I'm definately in the handling department when it comes to lowering. The Golf is on FK highsport coilovers and handles brilliantly, it puts a big, cheesy grin on my kisser, especially on A & B roads. It has standard wheels with no mad camber. I personally think if I started messing with the camber, bigger wheels, stretched tyres and went lower, it would be unuseable for my needs as a daily. The problem I have now is that whenever I see a mk2 with a standard ride height, it just doesn't look right at all......
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1993 Mercedes-Benz 190e LE in Azzuro Blue.
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