lowen
Part of things
Posts: 47 
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After many years of slowly acquiring parts, looking round retro rides gatherings, reading up and thinking about turbocharging, supercharging and diesels, I finally thought "yeah lets do it" and compound charged my Series 3 in pursuit of the famed whine and driveable torque.
Background story: The main push was that it was my daily car for 2 years, starting off with a very lacking power and smokey 2 1/4 diesel that I only did a few miles a day in after it had a full rebuild back in 2011, at this stage it was a very standard looking Land Rover pick up.
After a couple of months my work situation changed and I quickly went up to doing around 300+ miles a week on the motorway meaning an overdrive was fitted. However as the mileage was put onto the poor old engine it began getting confused whether to burn diesel or the engine oil so each week I was putting atleast a litre of Asda's finest 20/50 oil in it every week and getting about 20mpg from a diesel, plus 40mph on hills on motorways was not a pleasant experience. One steady drive home from college (a 100 mile round trip part of my apprenticeship) as it came upto my junction a sudden deafening rattly noise appeared and a cloud of smoke that shrouded the motorway came from my exhaust, thinking it was probably knackered beyond repair I just kept going and upon inspection found two of the pistons had broken up and the rattling was the piston rings being spat out. The bores were atleast 0.5mm worn so I just stuck another two used pistons I had back in to get it going again which lasted several more thousand miles!
I realised it best to quickly think about doing something about the engine so quickly got a 200tdi rebuilt and fitted in its place June 2012 after seeing how much better they are for daily use. The diffs got changed to a higher ratio to account for the extra torque increase giving around 30 - 40mpg depending on how I was driving and stayed the same layout up til August 2013 where had a top mount intercooler, very good for melting snow off the bonnet. It had minor tweaks such as the injector pump diaphragm turned 90 degrees on the bosch injector pump which helped it pull low down, and some chav busting black smoke out the exhaust I made which is a stainless 2.5" side exit by the passenger door just at the right height to be aimed at Saxo windows at traffic light situations  . Also I started running it on vegetable oil from supermarkets which I found has a small bit more poke and mpg than diesel does, usually ran at about 75% cooking oil, no more than 10% waste engine oil to save dumping it at a recycling centre I can't take my Landy in, then the rest diesel to help it cold start. Over this winter I'm hoping to fit a heating kit and an auxiliary tank to allow me to run diesel to start then 90% waste / cooking oil.
That's the last two years summed up and when I acquired myself a Rover 418D Tourer as a cheaper daily car it allowed me to get carried away turning the Series into a proper toy and learning from it, starting from the next weekend after Retro Rides Gathering 2013.
My goal is to learn about turbocharging, supercharging and compound charging as well as diesel tuning, but also to prove to the internet and the world it works very successfully for what I want to achieve which is general all round driveability with pulling power from idle. Plus ofcourse I get to play with a supercharger and make soot clouds and just general putting a smile on my face driving it!
The general configuration due to where I can locate parts will be Air Filter -> Turbo -> Supercharger -> Chargecooler -> Emergency Kill Flap (Impreza throttle body) -> Inlet manifold although the chargecooler is not yet fitted. I used a 300tdi Idler pulley with 145mm diameter and made up an aluminium spacer to fit it to the crank pulley, an Eaton M45 off a BMW Mini with a 65mm pulley, several; hoses, clips, pipes and sizes of stainless steel to save me having to paint anything plus practising my TIG welding on it all. I started off knowing that the standard turbo gave me around 12psi and having the waste gate permanently shut gave about 16psi tops on standard pump settings. Theoretically it was only going to give about 5psi from the supercharger which I thought would be enough but with a quick drive I found it was definitely not enough so a smaller supercharger pulley was fitted which theoreticaly should give about 9psi by itself, equivalent to having a 4litre diesel fitted . After doing some driving about it does manage to give 8 - 10psi higher up the revs along with the famed whine but at idle it only has about 2psi currently which I haven't fully investigated yet, however it does rise up from this very quickly. The turbo isn't big enough for doing this as it just can't pump enough air through so can only push about 10psi currently but the pump also needs winding up to account for the big increase in air going in now. In total I reckon I've seen about 22psi tops which in an old Land Rover is rather pokey  .
Just a quick test video I did showing the boost pressures (and one of the high pressure hoses popping off near the end thanks to cheap jubilee clamps) , this shows me pulling up a big hill in 4th gear from 30mph to 50mph very quickly, before I fitted the supercharger it would only just manage 3rd if left to struggle up it.
I'm currently waiting on photobucket to upload my pictures but here's how the engine bay looked when I went out for this test video so I don't leave a cliffhanger, slowly I'm tidying it all up.
However, it works! And is actually very nice to drive pulling from idle (20mph in 4th) and upto cruising speed very easily, plus it doesn't use much more fuel than before. The only downside is as I currently have no air filter it is a bit whiney on the motorway but hey, it's a supercharger! |
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Last Edit: Apr 3, 2020 18:58:53 GMT by lowen
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good man I'm a big fan of tuning the oil burners my 2.8 iveco is running 22psi of boost  |
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That's my kind of engineering |
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tears streaming at the end of that!!!! the noise it made when the hose popped off was amusing.
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lowen
Part of things
Posts: 47
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Oct 10, 2013 21:53:42 GMT
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Eventually hoping for no more than 30psi, which will require a bigger turbo, it's a rond number at 2bar and I want it as a daily car without getting eager for breaking things with my right foot. Claymore, your Volvo a few years back with the whine is what sealed me on superchargers for sure, I was pleased to finally see it when the bonnet was open at Retro Rides this year. It's quite a funny noise, the first day I drove it to work that same hose clip broke part way and it popped off again, had to do 15miles with no boost and a VERY loud diesel induction clatter. Yes it is, it seems to be coping ok, I had to fit a new clutch earlier in the year as the old one lost it's spring so in sight of supercharging I paid out on decent clutch parts so they should be fine, plus last year I had to rebuild it after the 3rd to 4th synchro spring snapped and locked it out of those two gears on the M42 so I checked over all the insides and it seems a good basis. I'm quite gentle driving it, never slam the gears about or drop the clutch as I know I've got to pay for and fix it when it breaks. I personally think that their bad reputation for breaking is down to old parts suffering age fatigue or being abused and badly serviced. It's insured for 150horses so want to stick with as many Series / standard parts as possible just to prove how good they are. Got a bit more tidying up done in the engine bay, I'm fitting a recircualting valve to act as a bypass for the supercharger nearer to idle rpm's so I can fiddle about with the pressures etc and learn, plus for the fun of it and challenge to prove you can fit one on a diesel, I'll be adding in a dump valve too to create that whoosh noise. This I'll be doing with a vacuumed hose pulling on the dump valve, operated from a pneumatic valve on the throttle which will work when at no throttle. This does mean that there are quite a few hoses now going back into the cab.  Also here's how the whole vehicle looks currently.  It started off without the canopy, nor green bonnet and lights and through having to add things it's gotten a bit un tidy, luckily having my Rover estate for current daily use has given me the time to be able to sort out the cut corners and also fit my bio fuel tank and fuel heater. I spoke to the garage on the site where I work and they are quite happy to offer me some waste engine oil out their cars so it'll help get my fuel costs down a bit and do my bit for recycling too. I'm not decided about the canopy whether to keep the farmer look all the time or to make up a metal pick up cover top when I don't need the canopy, Eventually too I'll be finishing the bonnet, i want to mimic the current Defenders that have that bulge in them as to most people they'll just think it's a standard feature, ideally I'd want to fit a standard bonnet back on however the chargecooler won't clear when I get it. Here's some of the pictures I took whilst making the brackets for the supercharger. Eventually I'll be remaking the mild steel parts into stainless so I don't have to worry about scratching the paint. The extra crank pulley is the idler pulley from a 300tdi, the tensioner is from a Disco 1 v8 and the idler is a 200tdi cambelt idler. The throttle body is from a 1999 Subaru Impreza Turbo. The main brackets are 6mm think plate so they shouldn't crack or break. All stainless parts are TIG welded, first time TIG'ing pipe and found it's a bit tricky going from flat to round but I managed.                                                     Sorry for the quantity of pics but its hard to show all details in a couple of pics. Any question feel free to ask and I'll try my best to answer them for you. |
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Oct 10, 2013 22:33:11 GMT
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This is very very cool, I like to see engineering solutions like this. How was the MPG affected after the boost was fitted?
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lowen
Part of things
Posts: 47
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Oct 10, 2013 22:51:00 GMT
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Its interesting to see how everyone does it slightly differently.
I broke my overdrive a few weeks before fitting it all so was down to 25 mpg pre compound charged, it's only been fitted for about 2 -3 weeks so far so with not having an air filter I haven't gone too far yet. However, as a guess id say its not affected it directly and if it has its only marginal, but its more tempting to make it rev higher from my right foot and the lust for the whine so that wouldn't help... As the throttle controls the amount of fuel going in theoretically it shouldn't consume any more so I'm keen to test that as soon as i can.
I have noticed that the throttle pedal doesn't need to be pressed as far due to the boost compensator part of the injection pump putting in more fuel from the lower down boost, kind of supporting the similar mpg theory. I've noticed in my Rover that driving off boost below 2000rpm it uses more fuel than on boost above 2500rpm as if the extra air helps make sure all the diesel gets burnt instead of making smoke clouds.
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Last Edit: Oct 10, 2013 22:54:03 GMT by lowen
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Fantastic update, I'm really impressed with the supercharger mount.
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megzy
Part of things
Posts: 364
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nice mod
have you though about running a full width intercooler and winding the pump. I did this on my old one and it ran so much nicer with little black smoke, ran early 30 on fuel comsumption and made first gear complterly redundant
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lowen
Part of things
Posts: 47
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Dec 16, 2013 18:53:13 GMT
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nice mod have you though about running a full width intercooler and winding the pump. I did this on my old one and it ran so much nicer with little black smoke, ran early 30 on fuel comsumption and made first gear complterly redundant At the moment I'm still in saving money mode, my aim is a Bullet Chargecooler where the long straight pipe after the Supercharger is and have the radiator for it mounted in the front. I'm not really fond of intercoolers - used to have one top mounted before the Supercharger hence the silly scoop. I'd much rather go for a Chargecooler as it's a bit more unique and more efficient rather than sending the pipes to the front as I'm lacking space there. It does need the pump winding up eventually as it suffers high up the revs but it drives nice at low rpms. Finally got most of the plumbing sorted and been able to test drive it for two months to see if it's worth it, and YES it is . Upto 30mph it'll have Saab 93's at traffic lights before I run out of gearing, it just needs to be a bit more stealthy as the whine at idle gives it away but that's refinement stuff which I'm not bothered about yet. For now the future plan is to use it over the winter to enjoy it. My wishlist for the next year is: -Get the recirculating valve and dump valve plumbed in to work off the throttle - just a mess around, no actual performance reason -Add a Holset HX30 / 35 where the inlet manifold is - as a show piece and as the standard turbo can't flow enough air -Get the supercharger geared up more to 3x engine speed (currently 2.66x) to help give a bit more go from idle and more whine - I've been heard half a mile away whining so far -Fit a Bullet Chargecooler - to keep reliability and condense the air back down My plan is to get around 1bar boost from the supercharger (about 80% of the M45's rpm capability will be used) and 0.5bar boost from the turbo to give 2bar overall. Driving around normally I see about 18psi peak when accelerating on the flat and about 14psi cruising on the motorway at 60mph so I'm after it to mainly work on the supercharger's boost with the turbo for pulling away. Once I've got it all laid out how I want it I'll finally be able to start tidying wiring etc. Here's some updated views:    To help with the confusion surrounding compound charging here's a simple diagram showing the overall boost pressures when the turbo is boosting and not boosting for my current set-up:  I know that parasitic losses and all that are talked about against superchargers but for the gain it gives I couldn't say I've really been aware of that stuff |
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skoze
Part of things
Posts: 382
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Dec 16, 2013 19:10:34 GMT
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Awesome I have SO MUCH WANT for that engine bay haha, wonder if you could cram it into an 80"...? |
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lowen
Part of things
Posts: 47
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Dec 16, 2013 19:23:11 GMT
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It would be worth a go! haha. The last time I saw a Series 1 it crossed my mind the amount of looks you'd get from it and how fun it would be.
It doesn't quite fit in mine yet, some things like the cooling are going to have to fit outside of the original Land Rover shape, the supercharger snugly fits against the engine so couldn't really be moved much closer in without losing access to the injector pump.
EDIT: I highly approve of the paintwork patina of your Landy
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Last Edit: Dec 16, 2013 19:26:47 GMT by lowen
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Steve
Posted a lot
Making progress in small, easy to handle chunks of awesome
Posts: 2,027
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Dec 16, 2013 19:58:29 GMT
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Big love for Series landys.....equal love for 200TDi's.....but you have both AND a supercharger!! I HATE YOU!! Well executed dude and bet it moves well Have been considering another S3 at some point and was just going to replicate my old SWB V8 but a tweaked 200 may end up in there instead Will continue watching with great interest Steve |
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lowen
Part of things
Posts: 47
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Big love for Series landys.....equal love for 200TDi's.....but you have both AND a supercharger!! I HATE YOU!! Well executed dude and bet it moves well Have been considering another S3 at some point and was just going to replicate my old SWB V8 but a tweaked 200 may end up in there instead Will continue watching with great interest Steve As a bolt in engine the 200's are great so I'd like to see how well it puts up with what I'm doing to it, they just lack low down pulling torque in un-tweaked form. The supercharger makes it much nicer for town driving than a turbo in my opinion as it's got the traffic light grunt and burns all the fuel going through it. After some pondering time I'm now getting on with improving my first go. First off is cooling the air going in, I'd already decided on fitting a bullet chargecooler but this is quite costy so I've decided to have a go at making my own cooler based around a Mini heater matrix (or more if one isn't enough), the water is already sealed and new ones generally come with a couple of years warranty against them so shouldn't be too much hassle to make an air tight box around it. Conviniently owning a mass of yet to be attached Mini parts I've got two heater units currently spare which will donate their matrix's quite nicely...    Unfortunately only one of them is useable, which appears to be the cheaper plastic and alloy one. The other had the air line through it and got some of the dirt out and I'll give it a blast with the steam cleaner but not really entertained by this one. The core of one I'm using measures 5 3/4" x 5 1/2" x 1 5/8" , with some vaguness to give guidance as water is about 4 times better at heat transfer than air, this core is slightly under 1/4 the cross sectional size of my previous intercooler which was supposedly able to cope with 400horses and just soaked all the heat from the engine into the inlet. So to me using one as a test seems quite viable with some quick thought and that including metal kicking about it will be a few £100 cheaper too. But I have my doubts that one simply won't be enough for the job.  It should allow air to flow quite well through it however I want the air to bounce off the sides rather than smoothly flowing so that more heat is conducted. It'll most likely result in quite a bit more pressure drop than things you can buy but again it's low cost so worth a go. Plus should provide some creativity making it look flashy!  I did a quick test with the hair dryer and sink to see what it's like at conducting heat and was quite impressed. You could heat it up over a minute and make it just bareable to touch, trickle some cold water from the tap (to mimic an efficient radiator) and would cool it down within 20 or so seconds so it conducts heat very well. To me this simple test helps me believe that it will do some good, even if only noticeable at lower cruising revs but it's a start. I've got a few goodies ordered and on their way to arrive soon hopefully: Garrett (possibly T04 e11 off a 5.9L Cummins or similar?) Turbo from a Daf 65 lorry Quickchange Eaton Pulley Adaptor 48.5mm Alternator Pulley (To attempt to make fit the adaptor although could be too small) Bosch 12V water pump for Chargecooler A horde of temperature gauge sensors to measure air temps (most electronic thing being fitted apart from the radio) After buying the turbo I had a second thought of instead of using one bigger turbo, to use two smaller turbos such as those fitted to 200's as standard. This is mainly as I have no idea how the bigger turbo will act compared to the small one currently fitted. The concept was them both plumbed in parallel into the supercharger with one way flaps on their boost sides to avoid electronic valves etc, and direct the exhaust gases into one turbo upto a certain rate then gradually allow gas into the other to help provide the quantity of airflow needed rather than pressure. But this is just thinking stage till I've tried the bigger turbo first. |
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Last Edit: Jan 4, 2014 0:41:54 GMT by lowen
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lowen
Part of things
Posts: 47
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Last Edit: Jan 7, 2014 22:22:06 GMT by lowen
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Awesome I have SO MUCH WANT for that engine bay haha, wonder if you could cram it into an 80"...? I hope not as the brakes and suspension would not be up to the job, I put a 5 bearing 2.5 petrol engine in my brothers 80 and that's more thane enough. But on the flip Sid we have also installed 3.9 V8's so go for it with the correct setup. |
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Some out the box but logical thinking going on here, I like where this is going.
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So much 'WINNING' for this thread, I like how its going.
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1976 Triumph TR7 v8
2003 Mg zr 105 daily driver
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Now that is a nice set up. I wonder how much would fit under a Range Rover bonnet?
Keep it up.
Ian
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1992 Range Rover vogue tdi
1991 Westfield
1970 MG B GT
To infirmity and behond.
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skoze
Part of things
Posts: 382
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Awesome I have SO MUCH WANT for that engine bay haha, wonder if you could cram it into an 80"...? I hope not as the brakes and suspension would not be up to the job, I put a 5 bearing 2.5 petrol engine in my brothers 80 and that's more thane enough. But on the flip Sid we have also installed 3.9 V8's so go for it with the correct setup. I reckon mine would take to it quite nicely, it's got decent brakes and custom parabolics - just the engine bay space that's the issue! My hybrid TDi's doing a sterling job so far, just fancy a little more without having to go for a bigger turbo. Got any video of it from the outside yet, Mr Lowen? |
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. Also I started running it on vegetable oil from supermarkets which I found has a small bit more poke and mpg than diesel does, usually ran at about 75% cooking oil, no more than 10% waste engine oil to save dumping it at a recycling centre I can't take my Landy in, then the rest diesel to help it cold start. Over this winter I'm hoping to fit a heating kit and an auxiliary tank to allow me to run diesel to start then 90% waste / cooking oil.
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