|
|
|
Where the hell do you people get your welding prices!! A bloke I know in bournemouth (kevin) does alright welding at nowehere near that price. I get mine from a guy who does a good job... Theres plenty of people will bang a plate over it for £20 but assuming you want the car to not fail its test again next year or even worse rot you have to cut out, clean up and do the job properly. £150 is like 4 hours labour. Its like the "really good" £200 paint jobs and the like you can get. You get what you pay for.
|
|
1937 Austin Street Rod - 1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1976 Rover V8 - 1994 Ford Fiesta
|
|
|
tigran
Club Retro Rides Member
In rust we trust. Amen.
Posts: 6,444
Club RR Member Number: 142
|
|
|
That's the thing i've seen his work and it's pretty alright.
Ho hum, better 'old on to him i guess (ooerr matron).
|
|
1964 Rover P5 i6 1987 BMW 525e - The Rusty Streak 1992 Micra K10 2001 BMW E46 316i 2002 BMW E46 330Ci 2013 BMW F31 320d 2018 BMW G31 530d
|
|
|
|
|
Mercs are wibblepoo at banger racing, BMWs worse- they're very weak. Its all to do with crumple zones. If a car has them it will collapse. A car can still be built like a tank but be no good for banger racing, amazons are a prime example. Cars are designed to take one heavy hit, absorb the impact and leave the occupants unscathed. Banger racing causes cars to be hit many times.
I'm told the farina was good at banger racing because it was an early attempt at a monocoque (sp?) and they found it wasnt strong enough so they added a huge great chassis underneath to stiffen it up. Its basically a monocoque shell AND a seperate chassis welded together. Granada mk1s and mk2 were designed using very early computers which over did the structure and made them overly strong. Not sure how true that is but its what ive been told!
Some cars you would expect to be useless at banger racing are actually very good. FWD Bluebirds for example.
|
|
Last Edit: Aug 9, 2007 12:28:58 GMT by Lankytim
1987 Maestro 1.6 HL perkins diesel conversion 1986 Audi 100 Avant 1800cc on LPG 1979 Allegro Series 2 special 4 door 1500cc with vynil roof. IN BITS. HERITAGE ISSUES.
|
|
|
|
|
Ho hum, better 'old on to him I guess (ooerr matron). if you 've got some one good, cheap and reliable you have the holy trinity. I know how long it would take me to do a Farina sill... dismantle the interior, remove carpet, scrape glue and underseal off, brace the door frames, drill out all the spot welds, then cut the floor away back to good metal, fabricate new floor sections, cut out old outriggers (bound to be rotten or previously bodged on a Farina), drill plugs in inner and outser sill panels, tack in new floor sections and outriggers, trial tack the inner sill, trial tack the outer sill. check fit and adjust / retack as necessary... seam weld floor sections and outriggers, plug weld inner sill and outer sill, grind off excess, chop out door bars, grind off door bar residue, seam seal panel edges, apply primer, refirt carpet, refit interior. thats a weeks work for me. obviously if you have a spot welder of your own you don't need to drill the new panels, but...
|
|
1937 Austin Street Rod - 1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1976 Rover V8 - 1994 Ford Fiesta
|
|
dugong
Posted a lot
One Of Us Will Live To Rue The Day We Met Each Other (Wire : 2008)
Posts: 3,292
|
|
|
I'm stunned that a Bluebird would be good at the banger racings. Going left field massively, what about an early espace? They had a separate chassis and bolt on panels (and all that curse word on Clarkson's video about that drophead one splitting in half was curse word, they cut into it) ... or would they roll easier or something? Vulnerable radiator?
Aaaages ago Brett Fraser from CAR raced an 18. I think he lasted one lap before the entire thing distintegrated (I think it was killed by a Farina of some sort).
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I always thought that the later Vauxhall Carltons (86-92) would be good for bangers, as Mk2&3 cavaliers are popular, but the lack of them on the track proves me wrong.
Its the same with Fords - racers loved Mk3/4/5Cortinas, hated Sierras, but early Mondeos are apparently tough so are proving popular.
It all seems to depend on the individual car. For the non historic events Volvo 240/740/940's are popular as the supply of Granada mk2s must be limited now.
Rovers are another one - the P4 and P5 are liked, P6s and SDI's not.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
If you can trailer the car and don't mind travelling a long distance (I'm near Heathrow), the chap that does my welding is very reasonable. He cut off the old valance/slam panel/radiator panel on my Minx, welded a new one on, replaced the old wings with fibreglass ones, patched the fronts of the sills, front floorpans, and installed two new outriggers for £350. It took him about four days. Also, he's happy to have a car in and work on bit by bit so that you can pay him slowly over time. PM me if you want his name and phone number.
|
|
1995 Range Rover 4.0 1995 BMW 320i Saloon 1989 BMW 325i Touring 1991 Mercedes 300TE-24 1991 Mercedes 190e 1970 Sunbeam Imp Sport
1966 Valiant 200 Custom 1964 Ford Fairlane 500 Station Wagon
|
|
|
|
|
Keep us posted amigo.
I've got a fair bit to do to mine next year, I'm sure. I did a welding course at my local college about 20 years ago, am seriously out of practice...but I'll have to rediscover my skillz in time for next May. I'm lucky in that my dad's amazingly talented with both gas and MIG, and so's my bestest chum Mr.v8devon...but the with Oxford I want to be able to stand back and say "I did that" when I look at it.
The Farina chassis thing goes back to the early days of the A40/A50 Cambridge, when they took the prototype monocoques over to Spain in late 1953 they quite literally fell apart during testing. It took a full 12 months to redesign the underneath, that's just how bad they were.....and that's why they are so strong.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Heathrow is a bit too far I'm afraid!
Ill keep everyone posted on the progress, or lack of, on the Oxford. Everything is repairable, but you have to throw in the towel at some point........
As far as cars suitable for banger racing is concerned, its impossible to find out if a certain type of car is any good just by looking at it. Its got to be raced! I raced a Reno 18 a while ago. Great car and very strong although the rear suspension snapped and started flapping about on cornering and it eventually stopped alltogether thanks to the engine moving backwards and breaking the drive shafts where they pass though the ported chassis legs. Sounds bad but it lasted all night and went really well.
All this messing with rotten old cars cant have put me off. Ive rescued another piece of motoring history tonight. Its on my trailer right now and perhaps deserves a thread of its own.
Wife isnt too impressed but shes saying nothing.
|
|
Last Edit: Aug 9, 2007 23:30:34 GMT by Lankytim
1987 Maestro 1.6 HL perkins diesel conversion 1986 Audi 100 Avant 1800cc on LPG 1979 Allegro Series 2 special 4 door 1500cc with vynil roof. IN BITS. HERITAGE ISSUES.
|
|
Samage
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,467
|
|
|
Wife isnt too impressed but shes saying nothing. Saying nothing as in hiding her fury, or saying nothing as in not talking to you?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Wife isnt too impressed but shes saying nothing. Saying nothing as in hiding her fury, or saying nothing as in not talking to you? No, shes talking to me but wont say what she thinks, ie its a rotten POS. "whatever makes you happy:)"
|
|
1987 Maestro 1.6 HL perkins diesel conversion 1986 Audi 100 Avant 1800cc on LPG 1979 Allegro Series 2 special 4 door 1500cc with vynil roof. IN BITS. HERITAGE ISSUES.
|
|
|
|
|
You need to learn to weld I was taught when I did my HND, but there are college evening courses that can teach you too. As said before, it's not super critical to get a good finish when you're welding chassis bits, just make sure you get good penetration. There are probably books in the library that can teach you too, but nothing beats having an experienced welder next to you when it goes 'bzzzzzzz' with the noise of frying bacon overlaid and he tells you it's a good weld. A brand new welder is probably yours for £100 or so? I've done more cars than I care to remember with my 90 Amp one so don't get carried away with needing something bigger than 150A. Don't get a gasless one, so budget for a few of the little gas bottles. Also get some welding gauntlets, 'cos it's damn hot! You'll need a welding mask suitable for mig welding, but they're not expensive. Masks for gas welding aren't good enough because the arc is brighter with mig. You'll need an angle grinder, some cutting discs and grinding discs to get rid of all the rusty metal. Don't forget safety goggles, they really are important and no matter what short cuts I take, I always wear goggles when grinding. You'll need some sheet steel to fabricate with, most car body panels are 0.8mm. Don't get anything too thick, it's the devil's own job to weld different thickness metals together, you'll either blow through the thin metal or won't penetrate the thick metal. Practice welding with clean (you've tickled it with the grinding disc to take the paint off) metal. This will let you set up the welder correctly for feed and current. Welding 'on the bench' is one thing, on an old car is a bit different. The enemy of the good weld is electrical resistance, and you'll need to punch it in the face for every weld. Here's my method which will ensure good weld penetration every time. 1. Disconnect the battery. And alternator / regulator, anything else that looks fragile (engine ECUs etc). It's not worth the risk. 2. The mig welder has a large crocodile clip which it uses as an earth. You want to clamp this as close as you can to where you're working. Big distance means big resistance. Across a different panel or hinge is obviously a no-no. 3. Welding is the art of joining 2 bits of metal, so there's a lot to be said for getting a jump lead, putting one end over the mig croc clip and the other end over the new metal panel. This just helps the welding tip to see a good ground whichever panel it's hitting. Much better conductivity than you'd get otherwise. 4. Clamp the metal together nice and tight. There are pictures in books of butt joints, overlap joints etc. Whichever you do, mole grips are your friend for clamping the 2 bits tight. 5. Cleanliness is next to Godliness. It's also vital for welding to get decent current flow. Tickle the metal with the grinder where the weld will be and where the croc clip clamps the metal too. You want no paint, underseal or rust visible. 6. If you happen to get zinc coated steel, grind the zinc off where you're going to weld. The fumes are poisonous. Good luck!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 14:22:15 GMT
|
Whats happening with this then? Seen it in your sig so many times I feel like I know it! Be sad to see it gone.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 14:42:01 GMT
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 17:59:57 GMT
|
Thanks for the advice about welding. Seeing as I seem to dabble alot in rotten old sh1tters I think welding is a very sensible skill to have! Just picked the Oxford up from MOT....... Seems the tester must have caught his wife in bed with an Oxford owner. The fails filled 2 sheets! Reg plate not working screen washers not squirting enough N/S headlamp not working on full beam O/S inner front lower (rear) bush gone N/S inner front lower (front) bush gone N/S front brake binding O/S sill body has an inadequate repair, seriously affecting its strength within 30cm of body mountings N/S sill body has an inadequate repair, seriously affecting its strength within 30cm of body mountings N/S chassis as marked has an inadiquate rpair, affecting strength within 30cm of body mount O/S front chassis as marked has an inadiquate rpair, affecting strength within 30cm of body mount O/S rear chassis as marked vehicle structure has excessive corrosion, seriously affecting its strength N/S front chassis as marked vehicle structure has excessive corrosion, seriously affecting its strength N/S front floor as marked has excessive corrosion, seriously affecting its strength within 30cm of body mountings O/S front floor as marked has excessive corrosion, seriously affecting its strength within 30cm of body mountings Front wheel brakes imbalanced Advisories O/S front bushes N/S front bushes O/S rear spring has a deteriorated shakle pin bush N/S rear spring has a deteriorated shakle pin bush O/S king pin slight play. All in all about £1000 See ya Oxford! Any offers?
|
|
1987 Maestro 1.6 HL perkins diesel conversion 1986 Audi 100 Avant 1800cc on LPG 1979 Allegro Series 2 special 4 door 1500cc with vynil roof. IN BITS. HERITAGE ISSUES.
|
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 18:08:33 GMT
|
Erm, maybe... I shouldn't but... Hmmmm... have to see if I can get it past SWMBO...
|
|
1937 Austin Street Rod - 1941 Wolseley Not Rod - 1956 Humber Hawk - 1957 Daimler Conquest - 1966 Buick LeSabre - 1968 Plymouth Sport Fury - 1968 Ford Galaxie - 1969 Ford Country Squire - 1969 Mercury Marquis - 1970 Morris Minor - 1970 Buick Skylark - 1970 Ford Galaxie - 1971 Ford Galaxie - 1976 Continental Mark IV - 1976 Ford Capri - 1976 Rover V8 - 1994 Ford Fiesta
|
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 18:12:47 GMT
|
PRE '68 IS HERE!!!!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 18:19:12 GMT
|
I hate to see one die, but..... What's the chrome like??? Has it got leather??
|
|
|
|
rowleyclassics
Part of things
Rowley Classics and Customs Coombs Rd Halesowen
Posts: 194
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 18:30:27 GMT
|
i might be able to help out, as you know i have my own unit, and one of the reasons my prices are a lot lower than any one else is because my overheads are real low and i mean low, i am aabout 40 mile from you so i am not to far away, hows about this for an idea a two day hard slog on the car, whilst you scrap away old underseal and prep some of the metal on the car i can follow you round making the plates and welding them on, done this in the past with someone else, put on 2 inner sills 2 outer sills floor repairs one in the boot and one repair in the inner wing, did the lot in one long weekend, it cost him £200 + the beer. note there will be no need for you to sleep as you will be busy grinding and scraping
|
|
1963 Hilman super minx 1963 Moggy Minor Montego estate HL Morgan kit car and 1 wife 6 kids lots of debts am i happy oh curse word YES
|
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2007 18:41:40 GMT
|
I might be able to help out, as you know I have my own unit, and one of the reasons my prices are a lot lower than any one else is because my overheads are real low and I mean low, I am aabout 40 mile from you so I am not to far away, hows about this for an idea a two day hard slog on the car, whilst you scrap away old underseal and prep some of the metal on the car I can follow you round making the plates and welding them on, done this in the past with someone else, put on 2 inner sills 2 outer sills floor repairs one in the boot and one repair in the inner wing, did the lot in one long weekend, it cost him £200 + the beer. note there will be no need for you to sleep as you will be busy grinding and scraping Tell you what.....if you're up for this Tim and we can work out a mutually-convenient date between us, I'll come up and pitch in too. Halesowen's only 15 minutes from my gaff. You know it makes sense!
|
|
|
|
|