Accord Type R - The other Type R

[b3nson]

Finally had the chance to get some photos of my new car today thanks to a great trip out to Sunday Scramble at Bicester Heritage.

As some may already know I sold my Integra DC2 a couple of weeks ago as I wanted a weekend toy that was more practical to enable me to use it to get out with my family a bit more. I was going to take my time and drive a few cars, maybe even wait, accumulate some more money and wait until the perfect car came along. Instead I agreed to buy this Accord Type R within 5 days of selling the DC2...

For those not up on their Type Rs, the Accord is probably the lesser known of them all. It has a 2.2L 4 cylinder engine, with fabled Vtec, making around 209bhp when new. Among various body add ons, bigger wheels and a massive spoiler, Honda also reduced weight where possible by ditched sound deadening and some bits of trim.

There are less than 500 left on the road in the UK so they're getting pretty rare now, mainly due to rust and abuse as they fell well into banger territory for quite a while. They're slightly on the up now but still a relative bargain for what they are.

On paper as it has over 194,000 miles, has no history and had only done a few hundred miles since it's last MOT.

I overlooked this because during 2018 it had a light 'recommissioning' by a chap who used to run Vtec Direct - it had a replacement cylinder head including valves, gaskets etc, a new clutch and lightweight flywheel and a basic respray. The paint on the rear arches is a bit curse word, but the rest of the car looks fantastic. I messaged the guy who did it and also confirmed it had a replacement engine at 175,000 miles, amongst many other repairs. He also confirmed that 'it's a good one', so that must be true right?!
It also has a super-rare leather Recaro interior that was a very expensive option from new, so my thoughts were at least if it dies I can sell that to get some money back!

Well the bulkhead (which is notorious for rust) is in fantastic condition, and I've now done around 400 miles and it drives like a car with a quarter of it's mileage, so I'm very happy so far. Plus it looks like a 90's touring car!


So the question is - it's half the price of a DC2, but is it only half as good? I intend to find out! Full comparison to come once I've used it a bit more, and I'll start to detail my to do list.

[j4mes]

You're going to enjoy this one, I've had mine almost 5 years now and they are such good fun. Don't worry about the mileage if it's had a top end rebuild, only real weak points are stem seals and headgaskets.👍
If you need any bits give me a shout as got quite a few spares now..

[b3nson]

Apr 28, 2019 20:37:38 GMT j4mes said:

You're going to enjoy this one, I've had mine almost 5 years now and they are such good fun. Don't worry about the mileage if it's had a top end rebuild, only real weak points are stem seals and headgaskets.👍
If you need any bits give me a shout as got quite a few spares now..

Thanks, that’s good to know! If you have a spare interior mirror or passenger air vent let me know, very unimportant but the only parts of the interior that need any attention!

[incarsolutions]

i've had 3 of these and they are great, 2 in pirates black and one in silver, i had the silver one and the second pirates black one at the same time 3 years ago as the black one came up for sale for £600 as it had a leaky rad and injector, it had 195k on it and drove spot on and still made stock power on the dyno, very underrated took my silver one on a track day at brands and was so much fun

[b3nson]

Time for an update after having it for 1 week, including the journey home I've covered 500 mils already!
I've done a couple of commutes to work and back, a few drives out locally with the family and an enthusiastic round trip to Bicester Heritage and back on Sunday.

I'm pleased to report it hasn't exploded yet, and hasn't revealed too many hidden faults.
With this I've prepared a to do list:
- Replace a leaking power steering return pipe - this was a known issue when I bought it, certainly the pipe has seen better days!



Luckily this is one part that Honda still sell new, so a trip to the local dealer will be made over the next week.

- Replace the windscreen - again another known issue is that the screen was cracked. It's only small and in the corner but it still looks rubbish, so I'll go through insurance for this.

- Replace the primary oxygen sensor - this was not known but to be fair is a very intermittant fault. After using and then left sitting for a couple of hours, if restarted it will hesitate after about 50m of driving and then clear completely. A chat with a guy on the forum who had similar issues has confirmed this to be a oxygen sensor fault. The car drives great all the rest of the time so I'm not going to do this urgently but it'll be good to get sorted.
Interestingly it appears the EML does come on on start up, suggesting either the bulb has failed (or been removed...). So again a bit of investigation into this is required when I can be bothered.

- Sort out passenger window as it only goes down 3/4 of the way, sounds like it's getting stuck so not sure if the regulator is knackered or just needs some persuasion.

- Replace the interior mirror as the mirrored part is all nasty around the outside, and replace the heater illumination bulbs as half of them don't work.

- Replace the A/C condensor in the hope I can get the A/C working for summer - definitely not a priority but again would be nice to have

That's all I've found so far, which for a 19 year old, 200,000 mile car is pretty damn good!

After it's back up to top condition then I'm going to start looking at wheel and tyre packages as it's currently on a set of budgets which are seriously hampering cornering performance, and although the wheels look nice in grey I've never been a fan of the standard ATR wheels. Fifteen52 are meant to be releasing a 'super touring inspired' range of wheels for 2019, which could be perfect for this!

[b3nson]

After a busy few weeks I've finally had time to do a bit more on the Accord, helped by the lovely weather we've had over the past couple of days.

First of all I've bought a OBD scanner off of Amazon that works with an Iphone, I was a little dubious but it had great reviews and actually I'm very impressed with it for the £15 it cost me.

What is has revealed however is that the engine management light isn't working as I suspected - either deliberately or not - as there is faults stored for insufficient flow from the EGR valve. This is another fairly common fault on the Accords and is usually due to carbon build up in the EGR system. There's a plate on top of the inlet manifold which I've taken off and cleaned up as this is the main culprit, I'll clear the faults and run it for a while to see if it returns - if so I'll have to take the EGR valve off and give that a good clean up as well.

I've also replaced the leaking PAS pipe so I can start using the car again. It was a bit of a pain as I was very conscious of not rounding off the 19 year old flare nut that holds it to the rack. Access being quite tricky as well led me to cutting the pipe up to get it off, and that allowed me to get a socket on the nut. With a bit of persuasion it came free nicely and all went back together fine.  I'll be keeping an eye on that level just to make sure there aren't any other leaks I haven't spotted.

Not the most exciting update but a couple of nice little jobs that needed doing. Next will be the oxygen sensor and then some cosmetic bits.

[adam73bgt]

Tidy looking Accord Those seats are very nice! Not sure I've seen ones in leather like those before

[j4mes]

May 14, 2019 21:46:59 GMT adam73bgt said:

Tidy looking Accord Those seats are very nice! Not sure I've seen ones in leather like those before

Very, very rare option and there is a couple of custom trimmed sets knocking around. Worth a small fortune, last set for sale were up for £1k and sold for £700 I believe.

Looks like you're working through the usual faults Benson, PS pipe is common as is knackered AC and tired 02 sensors. They are worth doing in pairs btw, andake sure they are genuine NGK ones, about £70 each..

Worth checking for rot in the corners of the screen when it's getting replaced, you can usually see it by the bonnet hinges if its bad.

Did you clean the small holes in the EGR plate, also pull the battery for 15-20mins, then reconnect and let it idle until the fans kick in (don't touch the accelerator or anything else). This lets the ECU 'relearn' it's parameters. Worth doing after 02 sensor replacement as well..

[b3nson]

May 14, 2019 23:03:05 GMT j4mes said:

May 14, 2019 21:46:59 GMT adam73bgt said:

Tidy looking Accord Those seats are very nice! Not sure I've seen ones in leather like those before

Very, very rare option and there is a couple of custom trimmed sets knocking around. Worth a small fortune, last set for sale were up for £1k and sold for £700 I believe.

Looks like you're working through the usual faults Benson, PS pipe is common as is knackered AC and tired 02 sensors. They are worth doing in pairs btw, andake sure they are genuine NGK ones, about £70 each..

Worth checking for rot in the corners of the screen when it's getting replaced, you can usually see it by the bonnet hinges if its bad.

Did you clean the small holes in the EGR plate, also pull the battery for 15-20mins, then reconnect and let it idle until the fans kick in (don't touch the accelerator or anything else). This lets the ECU 'relearn' it's parameters. Worth doing after 02 sensor replacement as well..

I've spotted the NGK sensors online, I was only going to do the upstream one but I'll get both if you recommend it as I've not got any history for when they were last done.

I took it for a good spin Saturday morning which was an excuse to test the power steering. The budget tyres are bloody awful, were squealing away with only the lightest bit of power applied while cornering. I have a feeling they're really going to hamper my enjoyment until I can get a proper set later on in the year, so it'll be straight lines only for me for a while!

[b3nson]

2 steps forward and 3 steps back is the feeling at the moment!
I had a productive few hours last week getting some little jobs done that I'd wanted to do. I replaced the faded rear Honda badge with a nice new, found why the passenger window wasn't going down (getting stuck on the inside of the door trim) and fixed that, and fitted a working cigarette lighter.
Unfortunately the car gods have not smiled on me, instead they have sent me a crunchy 5th gear and a potential oil pressure issue 

I noticed the 5th on the way back from work the other day, which is annoying as I've done the best part of 800 miles with no sign and then it suddenly started crunching when shifting from high revs in 4th. It's absolutely fine under 4500 revs so is very easy to drive around it on a daily basis, however it's frustrating as it'll definitely need a new synchro and associated bits in future.

More concerning at the moment is a new problem when cornering hard it stutters and either doesn't engage or drops out of vtec. General consensus on the Accord facebook group is a oil pressure issue, however as the oil is definitely at the max and it supposes to have a baffled sump, this could point to something more sinister. It would seem the first place to start is slightly overfilling the oil and seeing if that helps. I'll then decide what to do after that! MOT is due in July so I'm likely to get that done before spending any more money, just in case there's other problems hiding.

All of which is has put a bit of a downer on the car, as I'm really starting to enjoy using it - it's definitely not as sharp as the Integra but just as fun. More low down torque and having it on fairly standard suspension means that is actually alot more suited to the fun local B road around me as well

[bigearmuffs]

I remember these in the time, I did lust after them then as they were a super saloon, I would love one now and they will only go up in value.

[sciclone]

When I had a crunchy 5th in my GTR but wasn't in a position to remove the drivetrain and have the car off the road, I was recommended to put Recline Shockproof gear oil (aka Smurf Blood) in it. I did that and it helped fix it right up.

Worth a shot if you can't have the family car off the road.

[b3nson]

Jun 7, 2019 10:05:22 GMT sciclone said:

When I had a crunchy 5th in my GTR but wasn't in a position to remove the drivetrain and have the car off the road, I was recommended to put Recline Shockproof gear oil (aka Smurf Blood) in it. I did that and it helped fix it right up.

Worth a shot if you can't have the family car off the road.

Thanks for the tip, internet reviews seem to very positive so I think I’ll give this ago before entertaining a rebuild

[b3nson]

Further update - not looking much better at the moment!

Vtec stuttering does appear to be low oil level, it was max one day and then well below min the following - a concern!
After getting very concerned it was burning it and throwing my toys out of my pram a little bit, I discovered an oil leak underneath. It was only leaking when driving and mainly spraying on the underside of the car and subframe, hence not noticing it when parked.

The leak was coming from around the oil filter, and I discovered it was pretty loose. I tightened it up but it was still leaking so I reckoned on the seal being damaged and that it would be a nice easy fix so ordered a new HAMP filter.
Replaced this, still leaking. Balls. It's either coming from the gasket between the filter housing and block, or from above the housing that I can't see. Either way, more than my skills/time/tools can manage.

I sulked for a couple of days and then decided that I need to do something as I can't drive it at all now with the oil leak.
I did think about giving up and listing it for sale, but it'd be worth very little as is. So the only option is to get the faults fixed professionally and then decide what to do (hopefully keep it if I can get some love back from it!)

With this in mind I contacted Ben at Vtec Direct Motorsport who are a highly regarded specialist in these Accords (and also used to be the business partner of the guy who did the work on the car originally). I've have arranged for Greenflag to take it up to them tomorrow. I'll ask him to give it a good inspection before doing anything, and if it's all good I'll get him to fix the oil leak and rebuild the gearbox.

So watch this space! Hopefully in a few weeks I'll have a properly working Accord... And then I just need to get a new windscreen. And an MOT. And some proper tyres... 

[sacredhart]

I love these.

Fingers crossed for your repairs.

[neilsdavies]

Good call on getting it sorted. I can never understand people spending so much on a car then getting rid just to buy another and go through it all again. You've got a known quantity so may as well get it perfect.

[Snoozin]

These have always intrigued me, they didn't make it to New Zealand, maybe even UK only?! I used to have the Japanese equivalent, a Torneo Euro R. Some light tickles and it made 220hp at the treads.

[b3nson]

Jun 24, 2019 8:33:25 GMT Snoozin said:

These have always intrigued me, they didn't make it to New Zealand, maybe even UK only?! I used to have the Japanese equivalent, a Torneo Euro R. Some light tickles and it made 220hp at the treads.

The Euro Rs are lovely, a guy at work had one on Rega’s, looked spot on!

The ATRs were Europe only, left hand drives ones had the option of championship white which is odd as the UK ones didn’t, yet they were built in the UK in Swindon.

Thanks for the comments people, definitely gives me motivation to keep it and get it working properly.

[b3nson]

I have it back, yay!
I took the long train ride up to Chesire today to collect my Accord from Vtec Direct after they fixed a long list of issues. I booked to the day off to allow me to come back avoiding motorways, and so I had a lovely drive back across Cheshire, Shropshire and Herefordshire.
The good news is it's pretty much up to scratch now, I had the guys there go over the whole car and provide me with a list of things to do. I pretty much said yes to all of them so in no particular order here is what has been done:
Replacement 5th gear synchro set, driveshaft seals and clutch
Replacement oil cooler seal (was leaking)
Replacement vtec solenoid gasket (was leaking)
Replacement gearbox mounting and new bolts in the front engine mounting (2 were snapped)
Replacement anti-roll bar bushes
Replacement oil and filter
Replacement sump including baffle plate (was leaking)
And finally, an MOT.

So it's quite a list, and quite a cost. But actually I felt it was pretty reasonable for all the work done and it's good to know everything has been checked, so hopefully no more hidden issues!

It drove so nicely on the way back, and was really the first proper cross country trip I've done it so really proved to me how fun it is. However I still need to replace the god awful budget tyres with something alot better, but that'll have to wait until the bank account/credit card has recovered.
I only managed to take one decent photo with my Iphone on the way back (as my camera battery was flat...)

[rotarypower]

Fantastic car! I have one as my runabout / daily driver and I love it. 

Such a hooligans car though, the only way to drive it fast is to rev the nuts off it, and you kind of look a bit of a dick when you leave the lights at 8k rpm!

Here's my pirates black one, I had to fix the wheel well rust (hole even) and have the roof and spoiler resprayed. Worth it in the end.