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Dec 23, 2009 13:17:08 GMT
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you mean - Saab?
Yes. The shock mount is actually bigger than the pivot point for the spring seat. Have never heard of anyone breaking a lower shock mount.
You obviously didn't read this bit...?
Furthermore, if you're willing to spend the money then there are brake upgrade kits available for the Saab setup which give you AP Racing 4-pot and various other setups. Brembo sell replacement discs which cost less than genuine Saab ones and are a good upgrade.
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Dec 23, 2009 13:44:19 GMT
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As far as I know, all Mitsubishi L300 front ends should be the same, from the 1980s to the present day. Not 100% sure on that though.
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Dec 23, 2009 14:08:53 GMT
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you mean - Saab? Yes. The shock mount is actually bigger than the pivot point for the spring seat. Have never heard of anyone breaking a lower shock mount. You obviously didn't read this bit...? Furthermore, if you're willing to spend the money then there are brake upgrade kits available for the Saab setup which give you AP Racing 4-pot and various other setups. Brembo sell replacement discs which cost less than genuine Saab ones and are a good upgrade. I did read it, just cant believe Saab parts are cheaper and easier to find than Ford bits are, if your building a budget car the more mainstream your components are the more chance your mate will have "some bits that'll fit that" in his shed nice and cheap.
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Volvo back as my main squeeze, more boost and some interior goodies on the way.
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Dec 23, 2009 15:08:31 GMT
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This man speaks the truth! I don't know how common they are in Europe, but the Mitsubishi L300 is like a DIY hot-rod kit all in a convenient drive-home box. The front end is perfect for mounting to a separate-chassis hot-rod, as is the diff, nice compact pedal box for hot-rod use and even a little under-dash heater/demister system. Basically just change the body, engine/box and chassis and you're away! Here's what the front clip looks like: Edit: Please note that this one has already been modified by a hot rodder, who has fitted a different steering rack (front mount instead of rear) and drop spindles. Regretably he hasn't yet sorted the Ackermann angles on the steering , let's hope that's next on the list. Looks like a nice compact unit otherwise.
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Dec 24, 2009 11:50:46 GMT
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Incorrect Ackermann makes for interesting driving! . For those that haven't clicked on Oldbus' link basically a line drawn through the track rod end ,passing through the centreline of the suspension balljoints should intersect the back axle ( or up to 1/3 of wheelbase in front or behind ).
On that set up the lines would diverge meaning lots of tyre scrub and larger than expected turning circle ,together with interesting cornering.
When you move a rack from front to rear ( not the SAME rack as originally fitted as it would steer right when it should steer left !) you have to alter /make steering arms to sort the Ackermann issues.
Likewise if you fit a clip into another motor you need to ensure you have sufficient caster to give self centring . On some clips it may be built in when the clip is level to the ground ,on others you will have to tilt the clip to create a usable angle.
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Rich G
Posted a lot
Keyboard Worrier
Posts: 1,059
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Dec 24, 2009 13:44:24 GMT
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after a bit of thinking . . . Vauxhall: is there a Opel-Version of the Viva?? Opel GT - if you can find one!
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Dec 24, 2009 15:06:48 GMT
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Interesting comments RE: Ackerman angles... What's strange looking though is that the hubs on that L300 axel look a lot like it would be impossible to achieve an Ackerman angle as the angle of the steering arms on the hub carriers relative to the hub spindle is a fixed angle. Looks like it couldn't be changed from the original design. So can hardly claim the guy has done it wrong as there is no way he could have adjusted it. I might be getting the wrong end of the stick here? Saab's are extremely budget. That's why I like them. Everything can be got for cheap because the cars aren't cherished like so many other cars. As the modding scene is so much more sedate than with Fords or J-cars you also have this situation where all the best stuff for these cars is cheap as well. Very little available in the way of anodised tat with stupid logos printed on when it comes to modding Saabs. Real engineering is the focus for most of the Saab projects I know of. I have an example of a mate of mine coming to me with his Ford Serria asking if I have any spare Saab wheels. In the end we fitted some Saab 3-spokes and threw away the Ford alloys. Then the car was sold to Top Gear and used for the Top Gear Stuntman clips. Here's my mate doughnutting the Serria on a roundabout. I've no idea who the kid is in the t-shirt... just some random kid running about. I also didn't film this, someone else was doing the filming. Here you go: Here's a still from Top Gear: This is a picture of some humble pie:
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Dec 24, 2009 15:47:09 GMT
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It takes more than the wheels pointing in the correct direction to have a succesful steering rack conversion If it's not right then it's not right surely ? The fact that you feel the design of the hub prohibits him doing the modification needed to ensure safe handling surely shows the wrong choice of component for his needs ? I can't see a close up of the steering arm but it looks rather like the bottom steering arms bolt to the upright ? If I'm correct there is the option of changing side to turn 'inside out ' to place the track rod end pick up point outboard of its current location meaning Ackermann would be introduced. Bolt on fresh arms could be manufactured from billet ,if no other Misubishi style arms were available to suit and interchange. Even if the arms were not bolt on they could possibly be machined off and fresh items made to pick up on existing bolt holes. It is possible the conversion is only half completed ,however it is also possible that is the finished item and the lack of attention to Ackermann principle may suggest the builder may not also be aware of the intricate relationship between the angles of the 3 ( upper lower and steering ) arms to ensure correct handling anyway ? A VERY brief oversight of steering requirements can be found here :- www.uk-hotrods.co.uk/v2/tech/tech_steering/steering.php
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Dec 24, 2009 17:14:03 GMT
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Last time i wanted uprated brakes on a cortina on the cheap i bought a set of sierra cossie discs for 35 quid new, and a pair of 4 pot princess calipers for 40 quid off ebay, added a couple of washers and bolted it all together, hardly anodised and expensive, i imagine Vauxhall/Opel stuff is similar.
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Volvo back as my main squeeze, more boost and some interior goodies on the way.
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Dec 24, 2009 20:28:01 GMT
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Merry Christmas everyone! Just to reply to everyone's comments on Ackermann steering angles, I would like to point out that the drop-spindles used on this particular L300 front end are off-the-shelf units made for HQ-WB Holden front ends, as Mitsubishi ones are not available. The Holden steering set-up (steering box rather than rack and pinion) is front-mounted in exactly the fashion shown on the L300 front clip, so I can't see how the Ackermann angles will have changed from the original setup for the Holden front end, apart from the car being narrower. Whether the rack conversion has been done right or not is hard to say from the pic, but it is used as an example in the government-published Street Rod Guidelines.
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Dec 24, 2009 20:54:07 GMT
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If that rack is now rear fitted then the Ackermann is correct, if it's front fitted (as in the text) , then it's wrong. EDIT , been back at looked closely at the picture it shows the output shaft for the R&P on the right side meaning that rack IS rear mounted and the Ackermann would be correct in that set up. However as described in the text ie rack is front mounted and you are viewing the clip from grille end ( not drivers end ) Check out this previously posted picture of a HC clip with a front mounted rack. Look at the positions of the track rod ends compared to the swivels ( and how much closer they woull be to the discs )and how a line drawn through them would intersect the rear axle. Then compare it to the L300 version.
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Last Edit: Dec 24, 2009 21:09:24 GMT by kapri
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