Traders watch out DVLA are about

[Deleted]

Mar 15, 2012 16:12:08 GMT Seth said:

Could they tow away a car that has a trade plate in the windscreen then.... Might bend some rules back in the trader's favour?

My thought was trade plates could only be used for moving/test driving/delivering a car, and you can't park up on them and treat the vehicle as taxed. I might be wrong.

How would it work then if dealers simply removed. or covered ALL the number plates from the cars? Long winded and a ROYAL Pain in the backside but would that work?

How does it work when i see it mentioned above "Customers cars". If they're customers cars they would not be registered to trade, but to a private person and therfore SORN'd? Example, I take my Fiesta which is SORN'd for MOT and leave it there for work/MOT?

Very worrying and typical of the DVLA. More money making ideas! They'll send traders underground! Dealing off driveways as "private" sellers with cars on SORN's!

[jiminwatford]

What happens if you scrap a car bought as a trader?

[scaryoldcortina]

If you scrap a car as a trader, it gets a COD and it's gone.

Also, Traders can't tax cars for the same reason they can't SORN them - only the keeper can do that, and an in trade car has no keeper.....

[xbo11ox]

You have to submit yourself for a VIC CHECK

[scaryoldcortina]

[galahad]

Mar 15, 2012 16:12:08 GMT Seth said:

Could they tow away a car that has a trade plate in the windscreen then.... Might bend some rules back in the trader's favour?

There are rules on how you're allowed to use Trade Plates, and specifically, you are not allowed to leave them in view in an unattended vehicle, if the get stolen, DVLA take a seriously dim view, and they have the powers to refuse to allow you to apply for another set.

[Hirst]

If any country has a more bureaucratic and badly thought out vehicle registration system, I'd love to hear it. What a load of toss! Often I wonder whether the DVLA is trying to make itself not exist anymore, just by doing things which are clearly ridiculous and will make everyone hate them.

[galahad]

What really irked me, is I asked the DVLA bloke, "what the hell can I do to ensure you can't take any of my cars away?"

He said that if they were inside my work premises, he in all likelihood wouldn't bother to enter and indentify cars to remove.

I said to him that why the hell should I essentially have to hide vehicles when i'm legitimate and have done nothing wrong.

The other thing to consider, and I said this to a friend of mine today who had three cars taken away by DVLA who hadn't even considered it:

Say a customer brings in a car that needs 600 pounds of work. Garage duly does all the work. DVLA drive by, spot that the car isn't SORNed, so confiscate it.

Obviously Garage owner notifies the owner his cars been taken. Owner contacts the DVLA, and goes and pays to have the car released and takes it away.

Customer then never sets foot back in the garage again, getting away with 600 Pounds worth of work, Garage suffers loss.

[PistonBroker]

Mar 15, 2012 17:19:39 GMT @weblefeck said:

How would it work then if dealers simply removed. or covered ALL the number plates from the cars? Long winded and a ROYAL Pain in the backside but would that work?

I noticed the other day that Land Rover Man on the outskirts of Taunton has done this to all of his stock. Now I understand why!

It just doesn't make any sense at all - I can see why people called BS initially. How the hell is anyone going to carry on a business?

[mini-mad-nick]

Couldnt you get the DVLA done for tres-passing if they were to come onto your land or buisness premises? its all blooidy stupid and the government need to start doing something about it :@

[carat 3.6]

Mar 15, 2012 21:16:11 GMT mini-mad-nick said:

Couldnt you get the DVLA done for tres-passing if they were to come onto your land or buisness premises? its all blooidy stupid and the government need to start doing something about it :@

That's what I was thinking. No unorthorised persons ect.

[galahad]

Oh, and another thing that I forgot to mention, just to show how overzealous they are.

The mate of mine that had three cars removed had them removed from parking thats attached to his premises, off the road parking.

The DVLA went to the trouble of checking with the Land Registry to prove that the parking was in fact communal parking for all of the units in the same area, so it specifically wasn't parking just for his unit, so they then said they were then able to remove the vehicles.

My parking is away from my unit, and I said to him, does that now mean I can't park there anymore as its not physically attached to my unit.

He said that because they have to take 12 photos of the car in situ, if I was to put a big sign in each of the vehicles stating who they belonged to, those signs would be photographed and he'd have a hard time justifying removal of the vehicles.

What pisses me off is that a decision can be made by the DVLA bloke on what he considers 'reasonable', and as we all know, one persons reasonable isn't remotely so for someone else.

He freely admitted they pick on traders and garages because they are such easy pickings.

Great Britain eh?

[PandaSelecta]

So the DVLA could turn up at this dealer and take away a £46K Nissan GT purely as its untaxed but cant be SORNed, is that right?

if so

www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2009-NISSAN-GT-R-3-8-Black-Edition-NISMO-/220798828395?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item3368a2bf6b

Date of Liability 01 10 2011
Vehicle Status Unlicensed

[xbo11ox]

This story is causing my pi55 temperature to approach 100deg, and i'm not even a trader.

[galahad]

Mar 15, 2012 21:32:51 GMT xbo11ox said:

This story is causing my pi55 temperature to approach 100deg, and i'm not even a trader.

Its why the word needs getting out to as many people as possible, before DVLA cause too much damage.

I don't think the government are even aware of just how big of a problem this could be, and it needs highlighting to stop this behaviour before it gets out of hand.

[composimmonite]

I suppose the answer is remove all the reg plates so the DVLA cameras can't identify whether the car on a forecort is taxed, Sorned or not by a simple drive-by. I assume they aren't allowed to physically mess with the car so even sticking a dummy plate with Dealers name etc over the original might work.
Another thought is steel hoops concreted into the ground and cars suspension chained to them so impossible to lift without doing damage to vehicle or property as I bet they aren't allowed to do deliberate damage just to lift a car. Of course warning signs would be needed on the cars !

Paul h

[galahad]

If people feel like penning a short missive to the MP responsible, MP Mike Penning is overall responsible for the DVLA: [e-mail]

[galahad]

Mar 15, 2012 21:45:27 GMT composimmonite said:

I suppose the answer is remove all the reg plates so the DVLA cameras can't identify whether the car on a forecort is taxed, Sorned or not by a simple drive-by. I assume they aren't allowed to physically mess with the car so even sticking a dummy plate with Dealers name etc over the original might work.
Another thought is steel hoops concreted into the ground and cars suspension chained to them so impossible to lift without doing damage to vehicle or property as I bet they aren't allowed to do deliberate damage just to lift a car. Of course warning signs would be needed on the cars !

Paul h

All the cars in my unit have Duct tape covering the plates, and my project Cavalier GSi outside has had its plates removed, as its so old, theres no visible VIN number in the window for them to get.

Ridiculous that these lengths are needed, but if they took conservatively three cars, that might well be enough to put me out of business, word of mouth would get round quickly enough, and no-one would return.

This legislation was never designed to target traders like this, its ridiculous.

[Battles]

My blood is absolutely boiling at this, I feel like I need to try and do something about this.

First up, FOI request to find out the investigation methods and evidential requirements that must be met before a car can be lifted...
**UPDATED**
www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/vehicle_removal

Is there any point in me writing to Mike Penning?
I'm not a trader, I haven't had this happen to me and I don't think he'll be interested in an "I read on the internet..." query.

[bortaf]

Ok i'll wind me kneck in on the lifting of cars (even though in my reply fron the DVLA above they state they cant do whet they did to your mate) but i'm still saying BS on the recording lark