1968 Daimler 250 v8 - Moving on

[homersimpson]

Sept 30, 2020 17:42:35 GMT goldnrust said:

Thanks for all the kind words guys

If you're serious johndregg I can certainly give you a heads up when the time comes!

Sept 30, 2020 13:53:21 GMT voucherboy said:

Hey Goldnrust., looking at the image of the rear hub/brake disk, to me the hub nut looks way too far off the thread. Also there's no washer or split pin. Was this taken as you dismantled it?  Maybe there's a valid reason, but just making sure you're aware buddy. Oh, been loving this thread BTW. Awesome work!

Hmmm, ok I shall investigate! It's a bad photo, there is definitely split pin in there, you can just see the tails of it in the shadow at 1 o'clock on the photo. Your're right about the washer though.

I've done 800 miles like this, with no weird noises coming from the rear axle, so I presume the wheels not about to fall off or anything! haha. But I shall definitely have a look into it.


Edit:

Right just been out to look, the drivers side, as per voucherboy 's picture.



Passengers side, the leaky side, yes has split pin as I thought... but I'd never noticed before how the split pin is fitted, drilled through the nut!



Eek! Yeah I'm not happy with that., won't be driving till I've got to the bottom of why it's like that. No idea how I didn't spot it before, I think I just saw castlated nut, split pin, all good!

Now the brake calliper lines up with the disk, same as the other side, so the hub must be sat in the right place? So weird that the hub isn't as far on to the shaft. You'd think if was that far down the taper, it would be sloppy?

I was only thinking the other day when I spotted the leak that I was glad to have not had to remove the hubs yet, as I hear it can be one of those nightmare jobs... looks like I'm gonna have to remove the hub!

Looks like the side with the problem is also missing the big washer behind the nut so the problem might be worse than it appears.

The brake callipers on this can be shimmed to centralise them so its possible that this hs been done or that the calliper just isn't central on the disc as it should be.

Either way as you say the hub has to come off and you have my sympathy with this as it can be a pig of a job.  From what i've learned doing four of these now I think you need a puller that fits to all five studs a pulls from inside the line of the wheel nuts rather than from outside the line of the wheel nuts.  The original hub puller worked like this whereas the more traditional 3 legged type don't.

It may be that someone has not got the keyway aligned correctly in the past or the key has slipped out and the person has forced it on using the nut. 

The other things to be careful of are to leave the nut on the half shaft when you are pulling it off as they can go with a bang and they have been known to jump across the workshop, also make sure you put something in the end of the axle so you don't cause it spread with the puller (I didn't do this on one and ruined the end of the shaft).

[goldnrust]

All makes sense homersimpson.

The calliper is shimmed the same as the other side, and lined up nicely on the disk, I know this because I shimmed it! haha.

Talking of knackering up the threads... the other thing that crosses my mind, is whether someone has knackered up the threads and cut the shaft short as a bodge to correct that.

[ivanhoew]

is it just a wrong and deeper nut GNR ?

[voucherboy]

f you need a puller, the one I bought from Amazon is currently reduced to £35. It's a great puller for that price.

www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00XGPVT2Y/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Agree with Homer on the requirements. 5 legs pulling on the inside of the nuts. Also, If you use a bar to stop the hub rotating, remember to add some spacers on the other legs to ensure the puller remains totally flat. There a bit of a write up on my webpage www.lootintheboot.uk on the running gear page.

Here's when I did mine with this puller -

[blackpopracing]

Sept 30, 2020 17:42:35 GMT goldnrust said:

Thanks for all the kind words guys



Passengers side, the leaky side, yes has split pin as I thought... but I'd never noticed before how the split pin is fitted, drilled through the nut!

I think the wheelnuts are on the wrong way around, the taper should go against the wheel to help centre them.

[voucherboy]

Ah, if they're like mine, they have a taper both ends!




Sept 30, 2020 19:38:59 GMT 1 goldnrust said:

the other thing that crosses my mind, is whether someone has knackered up the threads and cut the shaft short as a bodge to correct that.


Looking at the end of that shaft, I'd be thinking the same. Photographs can be difficult to see properly, but it doesn't look good TBH, I'd pop off that nut and take a closer look.  After all you've been through with this car, I do hope it's good news for you mate.  

[goldnrust]

Sept 30, 2020 19:50:48 GMT blackpopracing said:

I think the wheelnuts are on the wrong way around, the taper should go against the wheel to help centre them.

I had exactly the same thought the first time I took the hub caps off myself blackpopracing! But as voucherboy says they have tapers on both sides.

Thanks for the extra photos and heads up on the tool voucherboy. I've ordered the tool, as you say looks a good price for what is a pretty substantial puller. I've welded up home made pullers for similar jobs in the past, for example to pull the hubs on my Triumph Spitfire, but I think with the scale of the axle on the Daimler, a proper tool would be a wise investment.

I think the nuts are the same ivanhoew.

I'll get the nuts off at the weekend, do a bit of measuring and investigating!

[austinpowers]

Is it possible that the half shaft is from a different axle. Maybe a different model of Jaguar, and is a few mm shorter?

[ivanhoew]

looking at it again, it does look like it has had a few mm taken off the outer face , the centre hole is no longer stepped ,and i think there is a hole for a split pin in there skulking ..too.

[goldnrust]

That idea did cross my mind austinpowers, as I know the Mk1 axle is just a touch narrower, but thinking about it if the axel was shorter the hub would still go on to the axle the same depth, but then the axle wouldn't locate into the diff as much, so kinda the opposite problem to what I have.

This weekend I did some more investigating. Now autumn is here, the carport is once again coming into it's own, building it was a very good use of those quiet days between Christmas and New Year a few years ago!



Removing the hub nut on the passengers (problem) side, and cleaning it up a bit, it's very clearly been cut down.



The threads in the nut and on the axle also weren't in great condition. Comparing it to the other side, I could see that about 3/8" had been chopped off
.


The only two options are to just put the hub nut back on and pretend it's fine, which I'm not really comfortable with, or to replace the half shaft. Before I buy a new half shaft, I figure its best to get the old one out and then I can see if I also want to change the wheel bearing or any of the seals.

The new hub puller arrived yesterday and I tested it out.



The hub came off with enough ease that I almost regretted buying the tool! haha But then I know you can fight with these things for hours if you don't have the right tools. Case in point, my dodgy home made slide hammer was no match for pulling the wheel bearing and half shaft out, so I'm once again waiting for the postman to bring me more tools!

[blackpopracing]

The nut does not hold the wheel on, the taper does that. The nut just holds the taper tight.
If the nut is torqued up correctly & pinned it should be fine.

If half shafts are cheap then replace, but though its been chopped (I bet someone cut the old nut off) it should not affect the overall safety.

The more suspect area is how good are the remaining threads?

[goldnrust]

All valid points blackpopracing

The threads are definitely suspect on the half shaft. They've been damaged and chased back over, and generally feel sloppy. The nut, whilst pinned, wasn't anything like as tight as the other side, and with no room to run the normal washer, the load on the nut isn't being spread as well either.

A half shaft is about £200, so not pennies. In this case I think given what I've already put into the car it's worth it for the peace of mind that it's done right.

[blackpopracing]

Yeah I thought the threads looked pretty poor.

You could fit the hub on with loctite - but you may never get it off again! lol.
Looks like a new shaft then - hopefully you can find a cheaper axle somewhere.

[crockpot]

Goldnrust, I have a pair of halfshafts here (somewhere!). If you know the length I can check them. I will happily donate them if it helps.

[goldnrust]

That's very kind of you crockpot I would obviously buy them from you, I was expecting to pay £200 for a new one!

I'm expecting my slide hammer in the next day or two, so will measure up the half shaft once I've removed it

[Stiff]

Only just caught up with this thread, love these MK2's!
If you need any parts for these there's an old guy not too far from me that deals in classics. Turns out he breaks MK2's. He's got rows of shelves full of parts for them.
I was chatting to him as he was loading a sold 2.5 Hemi block onto a pallet. Turns out he's got about a dozen more hemi's round the back and even a pretty rare manual one. Interesting old guy.
Not sure of his prices but I have his number if you get stuck.

[crockpot]

Goldnrust, I'll have a look today for them (I've seen them recently) and measure them. You'll have the answer as soon as you get it out then.

[crockpot]

Found them. They are a bit scruffy but it's just grease, overspray and a touch of surface rust. Looks like you will get free nuts as well!
They are 730mm long.



Good luck with getting the hubs off, I used a 30ton press and still had to use heat as well. They went with a hell of a bang.

[ivanhoew]

I think the hubs off crockpot ?

[crockpot]

Damnit! Missed that.