Econo Jag MK2 1967 2.4 Auto

[homersimpson]

Sept 22, 2020 17:25:19 GMT Paul Y said:

From the pictures the roof looks good!

Not a project I could take on but really enjoyed watching you work through the challenges.

Do you have a final colour in mind as yet?

P.

The thing is i'm no different to anyone else and if I can do it so can you :-)

I'm thinking that I will paint it opalescent blue which is a colour my wife wanted me to do it in.  Its a really nice colour and I like but i'm a bit concerned about painting clear of base as i've not painted a whole car in this way before (and only painted a few cars in solid colours so hardly an expert!).

[goldnrust]

Opalescent Blue looks great (if google has found me picture of the right colour! haha), go for it!

I'm far from a paint expert, but I haven't found clear over base any harder to paint than solid colours really. I think the main difference (aside from twice as much cleaning out of the pain gun) is just that with metallic, and other non-solid finishes, you can't just sand runs and other imperfections out. Well you can, but you need to spot them before you do the clear, sand back then blow over the affected area with more base colour. I tended to go a bit lighter with base colour coats to avoid any runs! The base it seems pretty forgiving to any texture issues so a bit of a dry texture or orange peel, in my limited experience, doesn't show once the clears on.

Once you're on to the clear it's just like painting with solid colour and any imperfections in the clear can be treated just like a solid colour.

Lovely progress as ever, gonna look great when it's done!

Edit: I should add that I've never done a whole shell in a metallic, but I've done whole panels and various motorbike tanks etc. Can't see it being any different!

[homersimpson]

Sept 25, 2020 17:06:04 GMT goldnrust said:

Opalescent Blue looks great (if google has found me picture of the right colour! haha), go for it!

I'm far from a paint expert, but I haven't found clear over base any harder to paint than solid colours really. I think the main difference (aside from twice as much cleaning out of the pain gun) is just that with metallic, and other non-solid finishes, you can't just sand runs and other imperfections out. Well you can, but you need to spot them before you do the clear, sand back then blow over the affected area with more base colour. I tended to go a bit lighter with base colour coats to avoid any runs! The base it seems pretty forgiving to any texture issues so a bit of a dry texture or orange peel, in my limited experience, doesn't show once the clears on.

Once you're on to the clear it's just like painting with solid colour and any imperfections in the clear can be treated just like a solid colour.

Lovely progress as ever, gonna look great when it's done!

Edit: I should add that I've never done a whole shell in a metallic, but I've done whole panels and various motorbike tanks etc. Can't see it being any different!

I've been looking at the paint and the colour I want is actually opalescent silver blue rather than opalescent blue, that could have been embarrasing when I had 5L mixed up!

[homersimpson]

Its been a while since my last update but i've not been resting on my laurels.

First I fitted the doors, boot and bonnet and made sure that everything fitted well and made a few adjustments.

Next I paint stripped and DA'ed the bonnet up, found it was rust free as expected but has a few dents in it.

Then I polyestered the doors and flatted the doors and bodyshell down ready for primer.

Next came the 2K Primer (using a suitable air fed respirator of course, I may be crazy buy i'm not stupid ).

For some reason I haven't taken any photos of it primed other than this one where I was trying out a dual circuit master cylinder conversion.

[homersimpson]

That brings me nicely onto my dual master cylinder conversion project. Some people have said they can't see why i'm bothering but having had the brakes fail on a 1966 S-Type due to a professionally rebuilt servo failing its something i've always been keen on.

It has been done a few times but I can't find any photos that really show how so this is how I did it.

First I purchased a complete pedalbox, master cylinder and servo from a Jaguar XJ6 X300 from the mid 1990's.

I played around with it a bit and found that there was no way it would fit with the X300 throttle pedal mounting (cast into the pedal box) in place and I want to use the original MK2 throttle system as it links to the carbs and gearbox with a system or rods.

I therefore cut these off with a disc cutter.

I tried it in place and found that the pedal box needed to be a fair bit lower that the picture below and also the brake pedal in an X300 cranks 50mm to the left which meant in a MK2 with the pedal box where I wanted it the pedal was 100mm too far to the left.

I looked into modifying the pedal but didn't fancy it and so I ordered a left hand drive pedal from a breaker in the USA.  You can see the difference here:

The little metal bar about halfway up is for the brake light switch on an X300 and its in the way so I chopped it off.

Then I fitted the original MK2 pedal box, master cylinder and thottle pedal to get the right positions:

Next I used a box, some wooden pieces as shims, some tape and marked the position on the floor pan so I could get the brake pedal in the right place.

Here is me fiddling with the X300 pedal box (note I did a final check with the old MK2 pedal box before welding it up to check that my spacer hadn't moved or changed shape).

I cut a section out of the bulkhead to give clearance to the brake pedal, this was seam welded as its two panels overlapping in this area:

Then I bought some 3mm mild steel plate and made a piece to sit on the bulkhead, I cut this to shape, bent it to position the pedal box at the right angle and self tapping screwed it to the bulkhead and the pedal box to the plate:

I had previously removed the studs in the pedal box and drilled them out so I could bolt through, I had to cut the side of the pedal box mounting flange down and redrill one of the bolts further in.  Then I welded captive nuts to the under side of the plate for all but the two nearest the bulkhead (as you cant' get a spanner or socket on these to turn them so will be bolted through from inside the car with a crush tube/spacer.

Next I boxed in the plate and welded it to the bulkhead:

The nearley finished product (just waiting for some long nuts and crush tubes to be delivered.

The issues left to resolve are that the wiper motor needs to move slightly and the battery needs to find a new home.  Otherwise it should fit well although if it were a 3.4, 3.8 or Daimler V8 it might be a bit different.

[Paul H]

Loving the updates on this project. It's really inspirational stuff

Oct 16, 2020 16:20:20 GMT homersimpson said:

That brings me nicely onto my dual master cylinder conversion project. Some people have said they can't see why i'm bothering but having had the brakes fail on a 1966 S-Type due to a professionally rebuilt servo failing its something i've always been keen on.

I'm guessing that was a probably Girling Mk2A? Those servos have an extremely bad reputation in Volvo Amazon circles, even when professionally reconditioned. Whilst the Girling was factory fitment, many now have Lockheed units instead(although the appearance of installations range from occasionally neat to mostly shocking, due to the mountings needing to be completely different).

[Alpina99]

Absolutely brilliant work here,
Your attention to detail and your intention to complete it all within a specific budget is excellent,
Really looking forward to seeing your future updates,
Nigel

[homersimpson]

Oct 17, 2020 16:43:41 GMT Alpina99 said:

Absolutely brilliant work here,
Your attention to detail and your intention to complete it all within a specific budget is excellent,
Really looking forward to seeing your future updates,
Nigel

Sadly the budget is starting to be a little stretched.

I'm at just under 6k now.

I need around £350 for paint and materials to get it painted.

I will then be left with £3650 to do the rest of the car which is going to be very very tight.

I have a feeling that its going to be more like 12K but I will see how I get on.

[voucherboy]

Oct 17, 2020 18:51:25 GMT homersimpson said:

Oct 17, 2020 16:43:41 GMT Alpina99 said:

The issues left to resolve are that the wiper motor needs to move slightly and the battery needs to find a new home. Otherwise it should fit well although if it were a 3.4, 3.8 or Daimler V8 it might be a bit different.

Hi Homer, I'm watching this with interest.  I am also concerned about using single circuit brakes, especially in an auto.  The conversions I have seen use a modified master cylinder and servo in the original position. The problem is that it's still single circuit from the pedal master cylinder to the remote master cylinder which, to me at least, doesn't provide a complete solution.  Anyhow, you mention that this conversion may be different if the car was a 3.4, 3.8 or V8, in what way were you thinking that this may be the case?  Thanks for the write up though, very informative. 

[homersimpson]

Oct 21, 2020 7:43:11 GMT voucherboy said:

Oct 17, 2020 18:51:25 GMT homersimpson said:

The issues left to resolve are that the wiper motor needs to move slightly and the battery needs to find a new home. Otherwise it should fit well although if it were a 3.4, 3.8 or Daimler V8 it might be a bit different.

Hi Homer, I'm watching this with interest.  I am also concerned about using single circuit brakes, especially in an auto.  The conversions I have seen use a modified master cylinder and servo in the original position. The problem is that it's still single circuit from the pedal master cylinder to the remote master cylinder which, to me at least, doesn't provide a complete solution.  Anyhow, you mention that this conversion may be different if the car was a 3.4, 3.8 or V8, in what way were you thinking that this may be the case?  Thanks for the write up though, very informative. 

The carbs are different on the 3.4 and 3.8 as they sit on the side of the engine whereas with the 2.4 they sit on top, the 2.4 is also a much shorter engine.

The V8 again (as you know) is very different in the engine bay.

I put the note in case anyone looked at mine and thought that they could do their 3.4/3.8 or V8 in exactly the same way without checking whether it all fits as I obviously have only looked at my particular car. 

If you are thinking about doing yours I would probably have a look at the later XJ pedal box (X308?) which looks to be smaller and probably wouldn't need the side cutting off it like I did with mine.

[voucherboy]

Oct 21, 2020 11:13:32 GMT homersimpson said:

The carbs are different on the 3.4 and 3.8 as they sit on the side of the engine whereas with the 2.4 they sit on top, the 2.4 is also a much shorter engine.

The V8 again (as you know) is very different in the engine bay.

I put the note in case anyone looked at mine and thought that they could do their 3.4/3.8 or V8 in exactly the same way without checking whether it all fits as I obviously have only looked at my particular car. 

If you are thinking about doing yours I would probably have a look at the later XJ pedal box (X308?) which looks to be smaller and probably wouldn't need the side cutting off it like I did with mine.

Sure, always best to throw in a disclaimer or two! 

I'm kind of at the stage now where I'd like to fit this as I've already started on the running gear. I checked out the X308, and from the pictures at least, it does indeed look suitable.  My only concern was that the brake pedal, same as the X300, has a bend in the wrong direction due to the more central positioning of the box.  I checked and LHD versions are available for this too of course, which I may end up resorting to. Welding up a brake pedal isn't really something I'd be comfortable with.  And I know if I did, it would be so over engineered that I would need stronger springs on the offside of the car! So thanks again for the write-up and the advice on pedals.  I've ordered one so I'll let you know how my fitment goes. 

[homersimpson]

Oct 21, 2020 14:16:39 GMT voucherboy said:

Oct 21, 2020 11:13:32 GMT homersimpson said:

The carbs are different on the 3.4 and 3.8 as they sit on the side of the engine whereas with the 2.4 they sit on top, the 2.4 is also a much shorter engine.

The V8 again (as you know) is very different in the engine bay.

I put the note in case anyone looked at mine and thought that they could do their 3.4/3.8 or V8 in exactly the same way without checking whether it all fits as I obviously have only looked at my particular car. 

If you are thinking about doing yours I would probably have a look at the later XJ pedal box (X308?) which looks to be smaller and probably wouldn't need the side cutting off it like I did with mine.

Sure, always best to throw in a disclaimer or two! 

I'm kind of at the stage now where I'd like to fit this as I've already started on the running gear. I checked out the X308, and from the pictures at least, it does indeed look suitable.  My only concern was that the brake pedal, same as the X300, has a bend in the wrong direction due to the more central positioning of the box.  I checked and LHD versions are available for this too of course, which I may end up resorting to. Welding up a brake pedal isn't really something I'd be comfortable with.  And I know if I did, it would be so over engineered that I would need stronger springs on the offside of the car! So thanks again for the write-up and the advice on pedals.  I've ordered one so I'll let you know how my fitment goes. 

If you have an X308 pedal box then I think this is the LHD pedal that you might need.

www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Jaguar-XJ-X308-2000-LHD-brake-pedal-X308-PUM13270/402503878297?hash=item5db719c699:g:cQMAAOSwqPBfjrft

[darrenh]

when econojag has more prep and workmanship than most peoples extravagant restorations.

[homersimpson]

I've been doing a bit more on the Jag, first I seam sealed the underneath using polyurethane sealant:

Then I seam sealed the engine bay, masked it off and stone chipped it using Gravitex.

I did a little bit of filling in the boot over the welded areas.

Then I seam sealed the inside of the car and applied sounder deadening pads to the floor.  The pads have a thin plastic coating that you have to remove if you want to paint over them so I peeled that off and then primered over them.

I had also already stone chipped the under side, I don't have any photos of that.  I used 5 bottles of Gravitex to do the underside and the engine bay which seemed pretty good.

Next I opened the tin of paint and stirred it until my arm ached, then I changed hands and stirred it until the other arm ached.

The engine bay was again masked up

And then I painted the engine bay and the underneath.  I put on two coats of base coat and two coats of laquer and it seems to have covered really well.

[eternaloptimist]

Love that colour.

[homersimpson]

Oct 24, 2020 22:13:05 GMT eternaloptimist said:

Love that colour.

My wife chose the colour,  its the only bit that she likes about it though. Otherwise its just a money pit that keeps me hiding in the garage in her eyes :-)

[Alpina99]

You really are doing a brilliant job of this car,
It may be an "economy" build but I think it's as good as most so called "professional" builds,
Really looking forward to seeing what it looks like finished,

[goldnrust]

Well that wasn’t the same blue I’d found when you first mentioned the colour, but it’s no less lovely!

Looking forward to seeing the whole thing painted, going to be such a transformation from where you started

[homersimpson]

Oct 25, 2020 8:53:27 GMT goldnrust said:

Well that wasn’t the same blue I’d found when you first mentioned the colour, but it’s no less lovely!

Looking forward to seeing the whole thing painted, going to be such a transformation from where you started

Yes this is the colour I wanted and I thought it was called opalescent blue but it's actually opalescent silver blue. Good job I found out before I ordered the paint or it could have been an expensive mistake 😅

[eternaloptimist]

Reminds me of Ford Blue Mink. My first Cortina was Blue Mink. Except where it had flaked off.