1959 Land-Rover Series 2. Seating, and distractions…

[glenanderson]

Yes James, the spare, spare, spare one definitely has value. I’m just not sure whether the work to strip/clean/evaluate and rebuild it makes much sense in terms of adding value if I’m going to sell it. I’d be better off working a couple of days overtime if I put my sensible head on. Like I say, it’s not in the way, so I can put the decision off indefinitely once I have got all the bits back together.

Gearboxes always look daunting, but a series Land-Rover one is about as simple and straightforward as you could get. When the time comes I’m sure you’ll manage it ok.

[mrbounce]

I always look at gearboxes as dark magic and something I shouldn't ever get involved with. That said, it all really is straightforward. It's just taking that brave pill to get started...

Fascinating as always - carry on!

[glenanderson]

So a bit more done over the last couple of days. 

I stripped down the mainshaft of the really bad donor, and it was just as much of a horror story as the layshaft side. Smashed synchros, broken bushes, chipped teeth, and even the mainshaft itself looked to have got hot enough that I wouldn’t chance reusing it unless it was in a last ditch attempt to get out of the desert “Flight of the Phoenix” style. Still, as I said, the two have yielded enough bits to make one serviceable one. I also pulled apart the mainshaft assembly from the good one my mate gave me all those years ago and, whilst it’s done some work, everything was still useable and all the end float tolerances were (just) ok. So it all got cleaned and reassembled. 



Here’s the special socket I made earlier this year being used to hold the input shaft so that I can tighten the layshaft locking bolt. 



With that done the snazzy blue end cover can go on. 



Nice. That’ll give the rivet counters something to froth over. 🤣

Next step is to fit the selectors. Or it would be if the seals I have in stock for the selector shafts were the right ones. Pants. Another order of bits. At least these are small enough to go in an envelope. So progress on this one ground to a halt. Fortunately, the new layshaft and gear for the official spare box arrived today, so I could fit those and progress that box too. 



Once the bellhousing and front cover were on that one though, I ran up against the same problem with lack of seals. I could probably reuse the old ones on this box as they’ve not seen the same services as the other, and aren’t rock hard like those, but they’re such a pita to change if they leak (and they’re only 30p each) it seems foolish not to put new ones in here too. So I had a tidy, sorted out the bits I’ve got to post, and cleaned up the leftover spares with a view to flogging them on eBay when I get a chance to list them. 



My gearbox hospital is a bit more “general ward” than “intensive care” now. Hopefully the seals will arrive early next week and I can get these both buttoned up and stored away. 

[grizz]

Clever clever clever.

Like the blue (most I can contribute)

[glenanderson]

It’s just metal Lego. You don’t need any “special*” kit to do a Series Land-Rover gearbox, just patience and somewhere clean-ish to work. We will keep the moment, having checked it would engage second ok, I went to see if it would engage first without the gear in place and shot the synchro detent springs into orbit, strictly between just you and me. Cue twenty minutes or more trying to find them, then another twenty minutes getting the little so-and-so’s back into place.





* well, you do need whitworth spanners, and I suppose they’re specialist tools these days. 🤣

[jamesd1972]

Was your special socket a clutch plate centre welded to an old extension bar ? Might have to copy that. Between us me & Dave got the reverse gear idler swapped and everything back together so he now has a working yard truck so all is good there and he is very happy.
Ref selling old box bits even one for spares / repairs seems to go for over £100 but one rebuilt would be up at £400 ish so while you might get more working overtime it might be worth it. Not sure how your home budget allowances work but round here if I sell something that becomes guilt free money I can then spend with a lot less issue. Mentally it's help me part with some stuff recently (bike bits, Lego technic) on fleabay that weren't doing me much good but were potentially 'useful' but I would much rather have what I want the money for - RTech welder here we come !
Anyway keep the updates coming it's nice to see.
James

[glenanderson]

It’s a drive member flange turned down and welded to an old socket, but yes, a clutch centre would work (and would have been my first choice had I had one).

I am a terrible hoarder. Not plastic bags and old newspapers, granted, but I can see how some people can become slaves to their possessions out of all proportion to their worth. I have decided that, once the parts I’m swapping with a S2C member are actually with me, I am going to reassemble the last gearbox, give it a cursory check and clean, and sell it on. I really only need one decent spare complete transmission assembly, even the extra main gearbox is something that I would probably be unlikely to use, and that might get sold at some point too.

I operate the same kind of “misbehaving exchequer” with anything that I sell, using the money guilt-free for other projects. It’s not really about the money though, it’s about making the best use of my time. I’m not rich, far from it, but I have even less time than I have pennies. I needed to rebuild the main spare gearbox, so that it’s ready to use if I need it, and I wanted to make use of the ‘box my mate gave me once it was clear that it could be combined with the bits from the scrap one and only cost me gaskets, seals and time. I might end up keeping it entirely out of sentiment, but the third complete transmission can just go “as is” rather than take up two or three days that could be better spent on other things. There’s also the sad fact that someone who buys a £200 “good” secondhand gearbox does so with the expectation that it lasts as long as it lasts, or is going to rebuild it themselves, so don’t come banging on my door if it breaks. If I sell a rebuilt one for £500 that takes me another three days work, it’s going to go to the type of person that’ll expect some kind of warranty - I simply can’t be dealing with those kinds of people.

[darrenh]

excellent work and i couldn't not mention flight of the phoenix. just goes to show what a great story/script/ensemble cast can do, when a film from 1965 can captivate a teenager in the 1980s

[ballbagbagins]

Nov 28, 2020 13:27:10 GMT darrenh said:

excellent work and i couldn't not mention flight of the phoenix. just goes to show what a great story/script/ensemble cast can do, when a film from 1965 can captivate a teenager in the 1980s

Yep, saw that film in the 90s as a teenager and thought it was awesome. I group it together with Ice Cold In Alex for some reason.

[glenanderson]

Nov 28, 2020 17:53:15 GMT ballbagbagins said:

Nov 28, 2020 13:27:10 GMT darrenh said:

excellent work and i couldn't not mention flight of the phoenix. just goes to show what a great story/script/ensemble cast can do, when a film from 1965 can captivate a teenager in the 1980s

Yep, saw that film in the 90s as a teenager and thought it was awesome. I group it together with Ice Cold In Alex for some reason.

Because, from an engineering perspective, it’s plausible. Maybe not actually possible, but not utter nonsense. 

[eternaloptimist]

Nov 28, 2020 18:57:13 GMT glenanderson said:

]Because, from an engineering perspective, it’s plausible. Maybe not actually possible, but not utter nonsense. 

Precisely that. I first saw it when I used to build an Airfix kit in a plastic bag every week and was probably picking dry polystyrene cement off my fingers as I watched the film!

[glenanderson]

No more gearbox progress, as still waiting for bits. 

However, I did turn my attention to this:





Which is my spare turbo. The one currently fitted to the Land-Rover had a bit of play in the shaft, but I’d hoped that I would be able to get away with it for a while. Sadly it does make the odd funny noise, and I think it wise to change it sooner rather than later. As it’s oil change time for the engine, I had better sort things out. 

I anticipated some struggles getting it apart, as it looks to be pretty much an original thirty-odd year old item out of a working vehicle and I have been squirting the fixings with penetrant for a while. Initial attempts at the four M8 bolts holding the exhaust half on weren’t encouraging. You can only get an open-ended spanner on there, and we all know how rubbish they are when things are properly tight. However, this was a perfect opportunity to try out my new blowtorch in anger for the first time. A good bit of heat into the housing saw each of them come undone ok, which was quite a relief. 



With the exhaust part off I could look at the other side, which is held in with a massive circlip. I really expected to struggle with this, but much to my surprise it popped straight out. Result. 😃





A swift run through the parts washer next, for the alloy housing, and a wire brush and a couple of coats of Aldi’s finest stove paint for the exhaust side. 

More to follow. 😃

[jjeffries]

I was going to ask what size spanners are required, but you answered before I posed the question. Did LR go metric on the Defender?

In regards to getting rid of accumulated stuff, I now find it liberating, be it selling or gifting. I understand your concern about buyers expectations. "No warranty expressed or implied" is how we say it over here. As in, curse word-off!

Great to read your updates.

John

[glenanderson]

Hi John.

Yes, Land-Rover started going metric with the last of the Series 3s in the early 80s, although there were still loads of imperial bits still. The 90/110 models were nearly all metric from the start, and by the early 90s, when the “Defender” name was introduced along with the 200tdi, they were metric throughout.

[georgeb]

Dec 1, 2020 1:54:53 GMT glenanderson said:

Hi John.

Yes, Land-Rover started going metric with the last of the Series 3s in the early 80s, although there were still loads of imperial bits still. The 90/110 models were nearly all metric from the start, and by the early 90s, when the “Defender” name was introduced along with the 200tdi, they were metric throughout.

They must have still been using up their old stuff for quite a while, as the '38 propshaft bolts are 9/16", if I remember.

[glenanderson]

Yes, nothing changed quickly for a long time at Land-Rover. 😀

Well, today was mainly spent on Union business, and running errands, but I did get a few minutes in the garage to reassemble the turbo. 

The refreshed casings came up very well.



With the paint dry, it was time to break out this bad boy...



It’s an upgrade CHRA (Compressor Housing Rotating Assembly), with higher spec bearings than standard and a billet CNC compressor turbine. The blurb suggests that the design allows for higher reliability and more boost from lower revs than the standard 30 year old design. Well, that remains to be seen, but it certainly appears to be a nicely made piece of kit. You can clearly see the difference in turbine profile in comparison to the old one. 



Fitting is a simple “reverse of the previous steps”. The only potential trap being the circlip’s tapered profile meaning you have to fit it tapered side out (although it wouldn’t fit into the groove if you tried it the other way). This is so it tightens the CHRA down into the housing as it expands. 



The finished article, ready to swap. A significant improvement. 



The new CHRA came with dire warnings about flushing oil, new oil pipes, cleaning intercoolers and pipework etc. but I am taking the view that such warning are for replacement of a unit following failure, rather than as a service item. Considering that I replaced the turbo feed pipes, flushed everything else out, and completely rebuilt the engine 1500 miles ago, I think I’m on fairly safe ground doing just the swap in conjunction with an oil change. 

In other news, while I’m still waiting on the seals, the bellhousing I swapped arrived today, so once the current gearboxes are finished and stored away, I have no excuse for not cracking on and reassembling the last one so I can flog it. 

[kevins]

Turbos on many moderns fail because of blocked oilways, the Peugeot / ford 1.6 engines were really bad for it at one time, fit a new turbo and pretty soon it too would go the same way. I guess it's that sort of experience that leads to the warnings.

[glenanderson]

Yes, that’s pretty much what I was thinking. 👍

[thomfr]

What a great journey is this Glen! I first saw this topic yesterday and spent the best part of the evening reading it. I use my old cars only in the mostly dry months but all year around must be even greater. I only wonder with the rather basic sound insulation material and a big diesel it must be still very loud. Never considered extra sound mats up to the fire wall and floor?
Great job! Enjoy it!
Thom

[glenanderson]

Thank you Thom.

Yes, I have considered sound deadening, and I do have some heavy footwell and seatbox mats which help a lot, but it’s always been a worry for me about additional stuff holding the damp against the panels. I’ve also been intending to replace the doors for ages, and so I didn’t want to be sticking stuff to them that was going to end up being wasted. It’s not as noisy as some vehicles I’ve been in. Hopefully, the next stage of development will see some improvement to comfort levels, but I have got other priorities/projects that take precedence for the moment. 👍👍