1978 International Loadstar 4x4, '71 vw Beetle

[Ratchet]

Oct 6, 2024 17:55:05 GMT Midas said:

Oct 5, 2024 22:37:47 GMT Ratchet said:

fire away ,


I'm doing it all myself, using a kit from frosts, which is pretty basic, but works alright, didnt need anything other than what was in it to get started.


I originaly got said kit maybe..20 years ago, was living with parents at the time and was religated to the (very cold) garage and it did not work out well at all, i presumed i was doing something wrong despite following the instructions to the word, so put it to the side in a huff...

After starting work on my loadstar, and starting to clean up parts that were in good shape bar surface rust i decided to pull out the kit again and look at why i got bad results in the past, tested it out and worked perfectly, only difference being was that i using it inside in a warm area, it makes a massive difference, you can use a tank heater, which would solve that issue if you don't have a heated area to work in.


The resistive dropper and transformer that comes in the frost kit is ok but a little a little crude, a better solution which I'm going to look at going forward is a good bench power supply with a current limiter.


i have mostly dispensed with the croc clips for suspending the items that you get with the frost kit, found stainless steel wire works out better

as for working out calculations for the area to plate.. ive found a rough calculation is all i need, at least for the smaller items i have been doing so far. occasionally I will get a bad result, and i've not worked out what causes it yet, but get rough/lumpy plating, usual remedy is to strip it off and re-plate, have also had to do this when it turns out there was still some rust on the item, which shows up very obviously afterwards.

Parts do need to be completly rust free, i tend to use deox-c or similar on rusty parts after blasting to get rid of any remaining traces of rust, also need to clean off the black oxide that forms on parts after using said solutions.


I do need to investigate where to get the scouring powder (some kind of bleach agent) that you use to clean the parts prior to putting them in the zinc solution in larger amounts, frost sells it in little bags, and while its not expensive from them i suspect i can buy it in bulk far cheaper



Have done a lot of smaller parts, bolts, fixings etc, and some bigger parts, including some of the vacummn pipes for the brakes i needed to get creative with those as the supplied bucket is a bit small, ended up using a 25l barrel with the side cut out so could get the pipe fully submerged, i then put some plastic containers filled with water in it to displace the liquid to get it to cover the parts (as i only had 10L of zinc salt solution) wish i had taken photos as it looked properly heath robinson.


hopefully thats helpful, let me know if you need more info.

Once again, thank you for the comprehensive reply, it's much appreciated for you to take so much time out like that.

Do you find the plating you get from the kits to be resilient? And, are you using the straight zinc, or one of the passivated finishes with it?

Cheers

Rich

No problem,

I need to look into the resiliance of the plating really, had some of the parts i did outside for a few months (while i was sorting out inside stoarage) and didn't note any change in the plating, however harsher eniroment may make a difference.

I am currently plating a couple of old bolts to test what its like left outside over winter, and will attatch one to the underside of my work van for the same purpose.

most of the parts i've done are straight zinc, have passivated a few bolts with the blue passivation again from frost but i didnt see any visual change, so not sure i did that correctly.

I have used the black zinc pasivation too and it as expected turned the zinc black, but cant confirm anything as to whether it affects the durability, need to look into this too as want to use the black zinc finish on the wheel nuts and some other exterior parts on the Loadstar

[Ratchet]

been painting a bunch of the larger hub/axle parts before it goes back together, under the clay/grease/dirt dauber nests they were in great condition, some surface rust but a lot of the original paint was still there,


for the hub, outside of the steering knuckle and drum brush painted it with some chassis paint (well my partner did it actually....) as have had good results with that stuff, dries really hard but doesnt chip easily and the rough casting doesnt show any of the brush strokes, and can spray over the top of it later, as not decided 100% on the final colour of said parts.


The inside of the diff cover, and steering knuckle were bare steel, so decided to paint those with glyptal enamel, it went on nicely onto the cast parts.. however brush painting the inside of the diff cover was a mistake as it looked awful, with sags and runs everywhere.. ended up sanding it all flat and then spraying it, and the result looked pretty decent.

The instructions call for it to be baked if possible, and by coincidence i have an old oven in the workshop just for said task, so in to it they went for a couple of hours cme out looking petty good, some wrinkling in a few spots possibly where the paint was a little thick, but overall looks very good.

Does seems good paint, and it best be at £100 a litre, looks very similar to what is already on the inside of the axle, and close to what i see on a lot of heavy equipment transmisions etc, (it was originaly made to coat transformer windings etc apparently)


annoyingly i didnt take many photos but heres one of the diff cover.



Got some two pack epoxy primer to paint the brake backing plate and the outside of the diff cover, along with some body panels i have finished repairing but seems i used all my xylene thinners, so thats next weekends job now.





While cleaning the Diff pan up i did find some damage to it, where something has coem adrift and been jammed between the CROWN wheel and cover, inspection of the diff showed.. well nothing, other than the spring from one of the failed axle seals around the axle.

It does however look suspiciouly new, and the differential has been removed and refitted at some point, as lots of red silicone so i now suspect that it also had a terminal failure, maybe at the same time the halfshaft did.

[Ratchet]

not exactl related to the truck but re the convo about hom electroplating,

i de-rusted these two manky old bolts i had to hand and stuck them in the electroplating tank while i was plating some other parts, as a test of sorts,

now this is worst case scenario, as the bolts are very pitted, and may have spots that the plating hasnt taken to, or where its thin because of the poor surface finish, though it looks alright visualy.

Will leave one outside, and was going to bolt or ziptie the other one under my work van to see what happens when exposed to road dirt/salt.
They might last two days before rusting, because of the pitting but it might hold up ok, will grab some less weather beaten bolts and do the same to them as a more realistic test....







updates when they happen....

[wildrover]

I got a small plating kit from Eastwood - it's primitive to say the least, but it does a passable job and it confirmed that it's possible in a home environment. I just ordered a more "professional" kit from Caswell Plating - it's being delivered tomorrow.

Caswell has a handy online calculator for surface area.

caswellplating.com/surface.html

[Ratchet]

Oct 7, 2024 22:24:36 GMT wildrover said:

I got a small plating kit from Eastwood - it's primitive to say the least, but it does a passable job and it confirmed that it's possible in a home environment. I just ordered a more "professional" kit from Caswell Plating - it's being delivered tomorrow.

Caswell has a handy online calculator for surface area.

caswellplating.com/surface.html

looks like the Eastwood one might be similar to what Frost sells (the original kit i got was branded as Barvic, but seems that names been dropped now) hoping to get an improved setup myself now i have more of an idea what I'm doing

and thanks for that link, should come in handy

[wildrover]

Hope the link helps out.

I am still awaiting the delivery of my new kit. I hope to do some test runs in the next week or so - I will let you know how it comes out.

In the meantime, here's a link to the Caswell kits caswellplating.com/electroplating-anodizing/zinc-plating-kits.html. There are some interesting videos on their site as well. I am sure there's a UK equivalent, it all depends on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go.

I am enjoying your thread and look forward to seeing your progress with the old beast.

[Ratchet]

Oct 8, 2024 20:51:55 GMT wildrover said:

Hope the link helps out.

I am still awaiting the delivery of my new kit. I hope to do some test runs in the next week or so - I will let you know how it comes out.

In the meantime, here's a link to the Caswell kits caswellplating.com/electroplating-anodizing/zinc-plating-kits.html. There are some interesting videos on their site as well. I am sure there's a UK equivalent, it all depends on how far down the rabbit hole you want to go.

I am enjoying your thread and look forward to seeing your progress with the old beast.

Will be interested to hear how it goes! i looked at ther site before realising was they were USA only, they appear to be decent quality kits, had a quick look for something similar in the uk, and found a few posibilities that are similar, and for a change similarly priced.

Thank for the interest in what i post, hopefully my often obsessesive eye for minuitae translates to the finished vehicle.



Revisited the passivation again.. and as before it worked this time, maybe i was being pessamistic and expecting more of a change, anyway, it worked, so went back and redid a bunch of parts, including the wheel nuts i just plated












And a comparison.. though its barely visible here, the left one is pasivated, the right just zinc, if you can't make it out, it has the blueish tinge you see on some commercialy produced washers and nuts

need to find a better way to passivate small parts though, individually doing them is a little tedious.. i have an idea though.....

[wildrover]

I love to see what everyone else is doing... it distracts me from the fact that I'm not doing my own project(s) Although my Stag is progressing, albeit slowly, but progress is being nonetheless.

I didn't think that Caswell would ship to the UK, what with all those lovely chemicals. I have no doubt that you can find something over there - maybe even better, or not - I live in California so we don't get all the tasty full fat chemical products that states like Arizona and Nevada do.

I am sure you have watched a dozen plating videos so I won't keep blocking up your thread but, I really do like this fella and his explanations are pretty helpful.



My kit arrived and I am chomping at the bit to test it out but, I do need to get a few bits and bobs before I can dive in.

[Ratchet]

First unrelated, but it is retro, took my FZR600r in for its test... sad to say ive barely used this all year...


pass though, after changing the brake lamp switch which decided to break en route

gave it a wash, will be changing the clutch plates soon as i think one has warped, seems bike was laid up for over 10 years prior to me buying it, and i suspect had the wrong engine oil in it when i got it as had an el cheapo unbranded filter etc, clutch would stick after being left for a few days.. an oil change sorted that but still got judder. (have done a bunch of work on this since buying it.. it replaced an identical one that was unfortunatly a complete lemon...)








then got some two pack epoxy on some parts, outside of diff cover, brake backing plate and some body panels,


I used UPol raptor epoxy after hearing good things, and seems decent, whether its any better than the other two pack paint like it out there is anyones guess, but it sprayed really nicely and drys quickly.

the mechanical parts will get topcoat directly over it, while the body panels need some finish work before prime/and topcoat.












And heres the inside of the steering knuckle with glyptal paint, as forgot to take photographs last week, came out fantastic, even if i do say so myself, it looks good on smooth surfaces, but i think it looks even better on rough cast ones like this.

[Ratchet]

Package of parts arrived from the USA

Seals, bearings, brake seal kits and a big ass socket

annoyingly seems the seals i ordered werent the ones i thought they were.. as are the ones that fit in the drum rather than the axle end one (info on these axles is a little cryptic, as parts manuals i have only list IH/navistar numbers many which are NLA, and the list of Dana numbers i managed to find has vague descriptions and no reference photos)

However i need these anyway, and have found the correct seals, as they are a standard(ish) size, plus found one navistar one in the usa for $10 too so bought that... will be making a list of the part numbers for future reference.


can at least get part of the hub assembly built up now, and can replace the damaged bronze bush in the stub axle, hopefully this weekend, though moving tools and stuff around too, can also send of the wheel cylinders to get them sleeved now that i have the replacement seals.

[Midas]

Oct 8, 2024 19:55:21 GMT Ratchet said:

Oct 7, 2024 22:24:36 GMT wildrover said:

I got a small plating kit from Eastwood - it's primitive to say the least, but it does a passable job and it confirmed that it's possible in a home environment. I just ordered a more "professional" kit from Caswell Plating - it's being delivered tomorrow.

Caswell has a handy online calculator for surface area.

caswellplating.com/surface.html

looks like the Eastwood one might be similar to what Frost sells (the original kit i got was branded as Barvic, but seems that names been dropped now) hoping to get an improved setup myself now i have more of an idea what I'm doing

and thanks for that link, should come in handy

Just taken delivery of a kit from Gateros Plating that comes with a better power source.

[Ratchet]

Oct 18, 2024 20:46:23 GMT Midas said:

Oct 8, 2024 19:55:21 GMT Ratchet said:

looks like the Eastwood one might be similar to what Frost sells (the original kit i got was branded as Barvic, but seems that names been dropped now) hoping to get an improved setup myself now i have more of an idea what I'm doing

and thanks for that link, should come in handy

Just taken delivery of a kit from Gateros Plating that comes with a better power source.

looks like a decent setup, will be interested to see how it performs. been picking up some parts to improve mine, looking to get a new power supply and heater etc when i get paid next

[Ratchet]

didnt get a huge amount done on saturday, as was moving tools around... (got a new smaller work van as i don't do call outs so often, so took my secondary toolbox to the workshop)



bf did take the knot wheel to the end of the axle though, and look how clean it is.. and man thats some agricultural construction right there, solid as its a forged beam with turned steel tube ends plug and seam welded in but boy shes not pretty.










put some glyptal paint on the inside of the housing too, it had something similar on there originaly by looks of it





ionce i get the axle seals can start reassembiling it


also decided on the final colour for the chassi, and found the type of paint I'm using (an overkill marine grade polyeurethane) so will get that ordered soon, wondering if i should pull the axle out altogether now so i can paint it.... or just do the ends at the moment as i originaly planned...




also cut the old bronze/oilite bush out of the stub axle and pressed in the new one .. after heating the stub axle with a heat gun for about 20 minsso it would press in easily

(i looked at geting a lab heat plate for this kind of thing.. a few years ago could get second hand ones for next to nothing, but seems phone repairers use them now so they aint cheap any more.....)

[Ratchet]

so having a slight change of plans.. and going to pull the front axle out and go through it off the truck, so can get it all cleaned and painted,

annoying as ive just sent off the wheel cylinders from the nearside to be repaired. and no doubt the offside also need sleeved.. doh.

i don't have a seal kit for them yet anyway so its only the price of postage i'll lose out on.


on that note, i pulled off the trackrod so can start cleaning it up to paint, man this is a heavy lump.. i need to weigh it but its got to be a good 40kg on its on .. nothing on this truck is lightweight










and sneak peak of the paint.....







lastly.. tryign to decide on the colour shcem for the wheels... originaly they were black centers with body colour rims,



now i'm painting the axle dark grey, and can't decide whether i do the centers that colour or black with orange rims, or go as with this truck and do the centers body colour/orange with silver rims....



I'm leaning towards the second, but would like to hear others opinions

[Rich]

In my mind those hub wheels (always known them as spiders, trilex or Daytons) should have a hub matching the main or accent colour and a silver or white wheel rim.



Actually bad example but I know what I meant 😂

[generallee]

Silver rim for sure, I think the centres come down to personal preference, but body or chassis coloured.

I have heard them called Trilex wheels, mainly in Europe and the colonies, Daytons in American, spiders in Aus.
I guess all variations on the same theme.

[Davey]

I like the body colour centres, This truck in general is just great.

[Ratchet]

Seems everyone is on same page as me ,

I call them Dayton type wheels, though seem to remember them beign called california wheels in uk truck mags back in the 90s

ones on my truck are made by firestone, or at least the rims are



Stripped down the trackrod on sunday for painting, all came apart like it was just built a few years ago...

And i found out why its so damn heavy, i thought it was a hollow, albeit thick wall tube.. nope its a solid piece of 2" round bar, with the ends drilled and tapped for the track rod ends. not going to bend that in a hurry thats for sure











After that I cleaned it up and painted it along with some other parts in the chosen chassis colour.. and promptly forgot to take photos

The Jotun paint went on pretty well, even if i didn't thin it quite enough, and the tip on my spraygun is probably on the small side, most of this is going to get a second coat once the axle is fully reassembled anyway so any finish issues can be dealt with then

[Ratchet]

Some more parts zinc plated and passivated, track rod clamps and bolts, and the steering pin




going to all be painted anyway but... i cant help myself.


The trackrod pin has a bit of wear, this one has more than the barely preceptable amount the lefthand one has, still minor and probably well within passing an mot, but i may well end up making a replacement (or getting one made)

The hub has a brass bush in it too, will get/make some of those as they are slightly worn, also trying to find some brass thrust washers to eliminate any up and down movement.





one other thing i need to look at is this special bolt, that holds the driveshaft into the drive flange, its a 7/16th UNF capscrew, but has a nylon plug in it, basicly the bolt version of a nyloc nut (have seen similar in other applications on equipment i work on).. obviously i could just use locktight but i think i can make one of these, just need to drill a bolt and get some nylon rod to press in

i did clean up and plate it anyway, but a new one would be better....

[Ratchet]

So went to check on the parts i painted last week, as had left them to cure over the week .. and they look ok, colour is perfect, but missed a few spots so will need a second coat, but far, far more annoying, is that *someone* has decided to move them durign the week around and clattered the parts together scratching and chipping the paint in a few places/.... lets say i wasnt best pleased when i saw that, moreso as i had deliberatly put them in a out of the way spot of the workshop to avoid this.

Extremly irritating and words will be had when i see the culprit as no need for that kind of wanton carelessness.


so yeah got to paint some of the parts again tommorrow, as well as dropping the axle out, moving all my painting equipment, to my own workshop now because I'm not having that happen again. (and tough if they wanted to borrow any of it).

anyway.

some pics of the parts that didnt get wrecked, missed a big spot on the backing plate due to how it was hanging up, so need to do it differently next time.












pressed out the trackrod bush from the hub/steerign knuckle, and made a replacment bush, got an oversize oilite bush , and turned it down, will need to ream it to fit the track rod pin, but forgot to take my reamers so thats for next weekend, can order a second bush for the other side now i know that it works, the thrust washer i ordered isnt suitible sadly, has the correct ID but needs to have a larger outside diameter, and be somewhat thinner, will probably pick up some thin phospher bronze sheet for this.











hopefully tommorrow will see the front axle removed once i construct some dollys to move it on, and some parts painted (again.. along with other parts i didn't do the first time)