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Jan 12, 2023 23:46:08 GMT
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I seem to be missing some vital information about restoring stuff.
I need to replace some original steel fuel pipes, or at least a section of it.
What I cannot find is a flaring tool for 8mm/ 5/16" Pipe other than cheap tools for copper, and I've no intention of using copper for fuel line underneath the car. Nor do I want to run a 2 metre length of rubber Hose either for that matter.
So what I cannot find is:
A flaring tool that will do cunifer or steel in this size
Joiner fittings to mate metal sections together
Original pipes come with a flared end where the rubber Hose sections are clamped on, and I'd want to recreate that. It's had a previous repair with a rubber Hose replacing a steel section and the end of the steel wasn't flared, and so it's still leaking.
All of this stuff is readily available for 3/16 brake pipes, so why not for 5/16... or am I indeed missing something obvious?
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Jan 13, 2023 13:17:22 GMT
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If you get the right size hose and slide it over the pipe around 100mm and fit 2 hose clamps (NOT jubillee) you wont have any issues. The other (cheap) option is to buy some 8mm compression pipe joiners from a plumbers. Fit these on the end of the pipe to get the olive to bite & then undo & cut the nut off. Instant flared pipe  |
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jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,835 
Club RR Member Number: 40
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Flaring a steel fuel line?jamesd1972
@jamesd1972
Club Retro Rides Member 40
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Jan 13, 2023 13:58:16 GMT
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If you get the right size hose and slide it over the pipe around 100mm and fit 2 hose clamps (NOT jubillee) you wont have any issues. The other (cheap) option is to buy some 8mm compression pipe joiners from a plumbers. Fit these on the end of the pipe to get the olive to bite & then undo & cut the nut off. Instant flared pipe Done the same thing with olives using 15mm copper to make heating pipes ! Does fuel line come in copper (bad) and Cupro-Nickle (OK) as well ? Have been careful to make sure always got this rather than copper. But not sure if this is still OK for fuel ? Is nylon a thing in the aftermarket ? Lots used as OE ? James |
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Jan 13, 2023 20:01:51 GMT
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As far as I know copper is fine for fuel lines.
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Jan 13, 2023 20:15:45 GMT
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on my rally car i have copper fuel pipes, the central heating stuff with the plastic cover one it and its fuel injected so high pressure.
On my pipes i basically rammed a screw driver in the end and enlarged it. For me i thought its quite important, the clip isnt just there to hold the pipe on, its there to "crimp" it to the copper pipe the olive or flare is there to stop it comming off.
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,712
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Flaring a steel fuel line?Dez
@dez
Club Retro Rides Member 34
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Jan 13, 2023 20:41:28 GMT
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Use kunifer, not steel. The only reason they were ever made out of steel is it was cheaper, not any strength consideration. A decent Sykes set will do 5/16”. Mine does 3/16”, 1/4”, 5/16” and 3/8”, and has re-lined many a car. On a full build I’ll typically do a fulls at fo brake lines, full fuel lines with return, Proably some autobox cooler lines and properly power steering pipes too, so it’s a worthwhile investment. Easily available second hand on eBay. The one that looks like a g-clamp is the best one. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/385349494695?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=u-lu-sylsh-&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=C7YL9ifOQj-&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPYThey’re more than than they used to be, you used to be able to pick them up for £30-50 but the internet has alerted everyone to the fact they’re miles better than any other type. Resale is strong though if you don’t intend to keep it. |
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Last Edit: Jan 13, 2023 20:44:00 GMT by Dez
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Jan 13, 2023 21:32:51 GMT
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I've used copper fuel pipe on a lot of cars using the microbore pipe that you buy at Screwfix/Toolstation type places.
Its always been fine for my cars, mostly carb systems but some fuel injection and if you need to make it in more than one piece to get it in the car then you can just use the compression plumbing fittings to join it together.
The only advantage that i've found to copper nickel (which I always use on brakes) is that you can get the ends to undo on the brake pipes as with normal copper they corrode and can twist off when you need to replace something a few years after building the car. I don't see this as much of an advantage for a fuel line which tends to be fit and forget unless its damaged and copper is a lot easier to bend to get odd shapes as required.
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Jan 15, 2023 16:32:49 GMT
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If you get the right size hose and slide it over the pipe around 100mm and fit 2 hose clamps (NOT jubillee) you wont have any issues. The other (cheap) option is to buy some 8mm compression pipe joiners from a plumbers. Fit these on the end of the pipe to get the olive to bite & then undo & cut the nut off. Instant flared pipe I've been sliding hose on as you suggest for a while now but it's just not a finished job on a resto - fine for a fix on a daily but not how I want restored cars to be... The olive idea is a good one though. I'll look into those compression fittings... |
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Jan 15, 2023 16:37:16 GMT
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Does fuel line come in copper (bad) and Cupro-Nickle (OK) as well ? Have been careful to make sure always got this rather than copper. But not sure if this is still OK for fuel ? Is nylon a thing in the aftermarket ? Lots used as OE ? James Copper is fine for fuel and there's no adverse effect, but my issue with it is that it will crack if twisted enough - and "enough" isn't all that much. So it's not strong enough IMO to be used for a highly flammable ignition source. I'm not all that keen on it for brakes either tbh but it's not nearly as high risk - there's much less chance of a brake pipe getting caught and ripped off, and it's not as likely to ignite. It may seem like overkill but again, I want things done well, not just OK. |
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Jan 15, 2023 16:39:35 GMT
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on my rally car i have copper fuel pipes, the central heating stuff with the plastic cover one it and its fuel injected so high pressure. On my pipes i basically rammed a screw driver in the end and enlarged it. For me i thought its quite important, the clip isnt just there to hold the pipe on, its there to "crimp" it to the copper pipe the olive or flare is there to stop it comming off. I agree, the reason I want to flare it is so that it's unlikely to leak or come apart, and provide a safer and more secure fit. I'd love to have metal compression joiners everywhere like brake pipes have available, but even if not, I'd still flare pipes for fitting rubber hoses to. |
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Jan 15, 2023 16:44:20 GMT
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Use kunifer, not steel. The only reason they were ever made out of steel is it was cheaper, not any strength consideration. A decent Sykes set will do 5/16”. Mine does 3/16”, 1/4”, 5/16” and 3/8”, and has re-lined many a car. On a full build I’ll typically do a fulls at fo brake lines, full fuel lines with return, Proably some autobox cooler lines and properly power steering pipes too, so it’s a worthwhile investment. Easily available second hand on eBay. The one that looks like a g-clamp is the best one. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/385349494695?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0&ssspo=u-lu-sylsh-&sssrc=2349624&ssuid=C7YL9ifOQj-&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPYThey’re more than than they used to be, you used to be able to pick them up for £30-50 but the internet has alerted everyone to the fact they’re miles better than any other type. Resale is strong though if you don’t intend to keep it. I should have been clearer sorry - where steel is concerned, that would be say a section of OEM pipe that is OK that I would then flare to join a rubber hose or kunifer pipe to (suitable connector pending) - I wouldn't be looking to make new steel pipes. On some cars I work on, they have a steel pipe over the rear axle that then is rusty or broken where it travels along the floor of the car, and I would retain the over-axle piece and cut off the bad bit, and need to join that safely. Like you I do enough of this that the cost of the tool is negligible relative to how often it will actually get used and the value of the jobs it's needed for. It's worth enough to me to invest the time researching and trying to find suitable tools and supplies so that I can do this reliably on many cars over the next few years, and make a good, permanent job of it. |
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Jan 15, 2023 17:47:44 GMT
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the Sykes Pickavant vice mounted lever type tool will do the job, I picked up a fairly basic used kit many years ago, be careful what dies are included if you buy used, as most were in the same box and optioned with whatever dies you wanted at the time.
you can buy new dies I'd imagine though
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Jan 15, 2023 18:06:18 GMT
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