Higgim
Part of things
Posts: 269
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Bear with me on this one...
Leading on from Hotwire's question on the Alfa thread, do you think the UK modded retro scene is somewhat stilted in comparison to say the Germans or Dutch?
The only reason I ask is that when you browse the forums in the UK, no matter for what make of car, there are always loads of people with big ideas about what they want to do to their car. Few of these projects are ever started.
When I go to a show such as GTI International, which is a big show compared to other marques, I have rarely seen what I would consider a "show stopper". You know, something fresh which really grabs your attention and makes you think " Wow I wouldn't have thought that would work - but it does!" I will concead that Danny Allen's MK1 and the Premier Two Tone Mk2 from 2003 can be classed as show stoppers but thats two out of thousands of attendees over the same period.
I am as much to blame as the next person for this as I can always think of an excuse not to start the projects which I build in my head on a regular basis. Is it that the Germans have more time, more expendable income and more imagination ?? I don't think so but I cannot think what the problem is here.
You might not agree and I know this site differs somewhat - especially as there are some Doers who are building their vision. Benzboy, Nightmares, Antdat et al.
Maybe I'm just upset that the UK GTI scene is a bit stale at the moment??
I will come to the Retro Cars show and hope to be proven wrong! Hey - it might even spur me on with my own ideas.
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Last Edit: Apr 7, 2005 8:51:26 GMT by Higgim
Vorsprung Dub Technik
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Nick
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,483
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i duno depends where you look, you get some really amazing some stuff in england... look at john beardsmore's minor.. ok not really a modded car or anything but look at the level of workmanship and amazingness.
i guess a lot of us don't have space for cars and stuff, cant blame people if they cant afford to make show stoppers if they have other stuff to attend to.
I'm gona get something its not gona be a showstopper at any rate and its stil about to take all my cash and be a pain in the ass
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idea stolen from rattely eddie.
this weeks car count "5"
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moot point mate. i used to be a small scale doer but now, because of a nasty relationship break up I'm relagated to being a sayer. i cobble along what ive got. id like nothing more than a turbo'd, nitrous injected 2.2 porsche 914 motor in my type 4, but for the next 20 or so years its only gonna be a dream. everyone will have a reason as to why they don't do stuff, be it lack of skill,time,cash or other commitment. its a shame but its true. hats off to the people you mentioned, their doing will keep me, and others I'm sure inspired
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Its just that differant types of cars are popular in england. Theres plenty of doers in the RWD escort or Mini crews but less in the J, Eurp crews as everythign is so much more expencive and harder to find.
I also tend to find the serious car builders in the uk try and stick to older 60/70s ares to get away from the modern ch*v/boy racer image that alot of modified 80s cars have.
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I've noticed that the Germans, for instance, seem to have a lot more expendable income when it comes to doing projects. And this really is a major factor in something going from a pipe dream to reality - as well as the available skills / tools / workshop space / understanding other half! ;D. From my own perspective, if I had money I would have my project finished by now, but I have to do things a bit at a time when I can scrape together the cash!
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Think of all the kit-car builders we have in this country. But then again, think of all the unfinished kits on ebay
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1997 TVR Chimaera 2009 Westfield Megabusa
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GavinJ
Club Retro Rides Member
MGB 3.9 v8 Sebring
Posts: 927
Club RR Member Number: 209
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I've had an ongoing custom beetle project for the last years i've worked on it on and off and all the hard work is done but why am i sitting here now and not working on it? I seem to never get anything done on it in the winter??? yet as soon as summer comes you can't get me off it I blame british weather
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Nick
Posted a lot
Posts: 2,483
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yeh man factor for me is cash (no job) and space (no on road parking)
still ive got the opportunity to buy something in the summer that a few of you are going to curse word yourselves over ;D
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idea stolen from rattely eddie.
this weeks car count "5"
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I'm afraid I can be guilty of being the kind of person who talks a good car but never really comes up with the goods. I've made plenty of excuses in the past too, no money, no workshop, not enough time, weathers curse word, ect ect. Trouble is, in england theres a real comercial kind of approach to car building in as much as if you want to build something your expected to go down the tried and tested route, buying all your bits off the shelf and doing things that have been done a thousand times before. Its only really with the advent of magazines such as PPC and this site that I've started to think differently about building cars and this has given me a new lease of life with regards to what i think is possible. In the past I've given up on projects because I've started to feel that whatever I do, someones gonna have done it before, or its not gonna fit into the mould of whats considered cool or retro or whatever. I've listened to the wrong people when the going has got tough, and when you feel like your banging your head against the wall it gets all too easy to just walk away. As for the future of car building, I think things are gonna get a lot better. I don't want to jinx the whole thing here, but I think what we're seeing on this forum is the start of a whole new way of thinking with regards to car building. There dosnt seem to be any snobbery on here and thats what the U.K scene really needs, to be able to just appreciate cars for what they are regardless of wether they're yanks, veedubs, classic fords or concours show cars. We've taken off the blinkers, now all we've gotta do is get out there and practise what we preach and the rest of the world will follow. Sorry if this has gone on a bit. What was the question again ;D
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The UK is a great place for car modifying. You might think the legislation is tough about modifying cars with the sVA test, increasingly stringent MOT etc but compared to what I know about the rest of Europe, the UK is a car modifiers dream. Here in France 'technical modifications' (an admittedly vague phrase) are simply NOT allowed! When you sell a car you have to tick a box affirming that when you passed the car to the next guy it had not undergone any major mods, otherwise you are breaking the law. So, here in france there are NO rolling road shops, NO megasquirt ignition systems, NO engine swaps, nowt!
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1972 Fiat 130 1985 Talbot Alpine 1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 + 1986 Mazda 929 Koop + Wagon 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 BEST CAR EVER!!!!!!!! 1979 Datsun B310 Sunny 4-dr 1984 Audi 200 Quattro Turbo 1983 Honda Accord 1.6 DX GONE1989 Alfa 75 2.0 TS Mr T says: TREAT YO MOTHER RIGHT!
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racer86
Posted a lot
'72 BMW 2002 / '72 Alpine A110 Gordini
Posts: 2,184
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i dunno, i think a large part can be atribbuted to the weather (its always raining and cold - everything goes rusty and who wants to play in the rain!) and parts are a lot more expensive over here. ill have to be a serious doer to get the chevette back in time for retro cars!
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So, here in france there are NO rolling road shops, NO megasquirt ignition systems, NO engine swaps, nowt! Wow that's HARSH!! I do agree the retro scene that has taken off in recent years has given me untold amounts of inspiration - just knowing that there are like-minded people out there really makes me feel good about the whole thing! That's why you can't get me away from this forum - the people on here really sum up what the whole scene is about, and I'm proud to be part of that! ;D
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I think another factor is that land and property prices in the UK are now such that many prime sheds, barns etc which could be good for tinkering in if they were cheaply rentable, have been flattened or restored into houses. Having a decent garage/workshop is pretty difficult in the UK for this reason I think.
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1972 Fiat 130 1985 Talbot Alpine 1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 + 1986 Mazda 929 Koop + Wagon 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 BEST CAR EVER!!!!!!!! 1979 Datsun B310 Sunny 4-dr 1984 Audi 200 Quattro Turbo 1983 Honda Accord 1.6 DX GONE1989 Alfa 75 2.0 TS Mr T says: TREAT YO MOTHER RIGHT!
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rev.dick deluxe and benzboy
what they said ;D
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I think another factor is that land and property prices in the UK are now such that many prime sheds, barns etc which could be good for tinkering in if they were cheaply rentable, have been flattened or restored into houses. Having a decent garage/workshop is pretty difficult in the UK for this reason I think. I'll second that. my workshop costs me £300 a month and its not exactly massive but I've been told that its actually pretty cheap (not just by my landlord either). Once you take that out of your wage packet it dosent exactly leave loads of money for buying goodies for the project that lives there. But without it, there wouldnt be a project at all, so its a case of the lesser of the two evils. I dream of buying a nice house in the middle of nowhere with loads of land and outbuildings but it just aint gonna happen in this country.
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Davenger
Club Retro Rides Member
It's only metal
Posts: 7,272
Club RR Member Number: 140
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UK Modders - Sayers not Doers???Davenger
@dminifreak
Club Retro Rides Member 140
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I blame Max Power for the blandness of most golfs and such like. You get all these muppets who are brainwashed into glueing nasty bits of plastic and shoving awful rims on, and everything endsup looking OTT andjust plain ugly. This then catches on, and pretty soon, they all look the same
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Modified cars not allowed in France?...
...I see loads of modded cars in france and some really wild custom jobs as well of all ages/era's. Plus theres plenty of car shows (like this country) in their country to prove this.
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‘Non-technical’ i.e. barryboy-style big spoilers and other non-functional curse word are allowed, so theres plenty of barried-up shopping cars, and a handful of people mod their cars anyway saying ‘well I’m never going to sell it so what the fugg’. Finally, like everything in france, if you know the right people you can get some mods ‘approved’ on an individual basis, but this is discouraged - what do you say when asked for a certificate of conformity for a set of fabricated engine mounts? Or asked to prove that the braking/crashworthiness/emissions performance of your car is unaffected by a different engine that’s gone in? Difficult. The upshot is there is practically NO DIY tuning/modifying industry here. Annoying cos there are any amount of great barns and sheds for storing old cars in!
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1972 Fiat 130 1985 Talbot Alpine 1974 Lancia Beta Saloon 1975 + 1986 Mazda 929 Koop + Wagon 1982 Fiat Argenta 2.0 iniezione elettronica 1977 Toyota Carina TA14 BEST CAR EVER!!!!!!!! 1979 Datsun B310 Sunny 4-dr 1984 Audi 200 Quattro Turbo 1983 Honda Accord 1.6 DX GONE1989 Alfa 75 2.0 TS Mr T says: TREAT YO MOTHER RIGHT!
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Finally, like everything in france, if you know the right people you can get some mods ‘approved’ on an individual basis, ;D ;D ;D ;D Yep know all about that
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I think to say that we are a nation of sayers and not doers is a little harsh. I think that considering we are pretty small island with the problems associated with lack of space and rubbish weather, there have been many cars that have come out of this country that I would class as 'showstoppers' and could stand along side anything the USA or Europe has to offer. I think that we get the impression though magazine articles and programs like American Hotrod etc that places like California are just crawling with show quality hot-rods and lowrider minitrucks & similarly Germany is full of Chromed MK1 Golfs and smoothed Kadets - in reality they are as few and far between as over here. As a whole though I reckon (away from plastic bodykit brigade) We prefer cars with go rather than show, and there are many people up and down the country tinkering and fettling the oily bits of their cars and are far less concerned about having the perfect paintjob. Amongst my immediate friends we have a number of on going projects (none of which will be showstoppers in the looks dep't) Which include a Mid-mounted S4 engined VW Caddy, a 220bhp 20v turbo engined VW bay panel van, a turbo'd and K'jetted Beetle and a Zetec powered 105 Anglia. As for me - i'm afraid i'm a sayer and not a doer, and if I spent as much time on my car as I do on here then I may have a showstopper on my hands (I doubt it though ) In my defence I really don't have the space or tools to do much more than general service and repair - or most importantly the knowledge or the skills
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