1972 Rover P6 2300TC - Saab B234 Turbo

[sowen]

May 8, 2013 18:56:53 GMT AtomicRooster said:

I really dig the valance on this, its even better than the standard v8 one, wish I had the skillz to knock up one like that for mine!

Thanks, it took me a couple of goes to get it to a point where I was happy, and I think I've nailed it now.

May 8, 2013 18:59:09 GMT adam73bgt said:

Looks like good work going on here, I really like this P6

Quick question, are you running the standard ECU? or is it Mega jolt or something?
Cos ive been looking at putting a M or T series in my MG and I've been thinking about potentially running it on carbs and was wondering how the ECU would cope with that or if I'd need to go Megajolt or similar?

Hope the new pistons go in without too much bother!

It is Megajolt controlling the sparks and Plain SU's for the fueling, set a little (lot, probably contributing some bore-wash) on the rich side as I was not sure how they would cope under pressure, but I've begun to turn the mixture down recently which has made a very significant difference on fuel economy, and not affected the performance.

The old T-series type pistons and rods are now out, and have absolutely no damage to the piston CROWN, which I am simply amazed at as I have done all the setting up on them, having minor incidents of over-boost, rich and lean running, and too much advance, yet they have survived very well! The older style M-series pistons and rods should hold up very well when I get them in, sooner the better as I miss not being able to go out for a blast in the P6 already.

[adam73bgt]

Ah i thought that might be the case, another cost I'd have to factor in then

[sowen]

May 9, 2013 10:00:09 GMT adam73bgt said:

Ah I thought that might be the case, another cost I'd have to factor in then

I think the standard Rover ECU and loom can be retained, it's just not my thing. To me the Megajolt is an investment, it can be lifted from one engine or car and put in another, plug a computer into it, change some settings and off you go again. I think Megasquirt and the other standalone aftermarket ECU's are the same, and even second hand, they appear to retain some value.

Then there's the improvement in performance over distributers, which over the years I've had no end of trouble with, causing poor starting, missfires, flatspots, reliance on stock ignition curves etc...

I now have control of the ignition curve and rev limiter, here's my previous ignition map, which had a little pinking at high load, mid-rpm, and has since been tidied up after a data-logging session on my daily commute ;D



Power delivery is smooth through all gears, and is perfectly driveable off boost, quite happily keeping up with general traffic, well worth the investment

[adam73bgt]

Aye i get what you mean about it being like an investment, I've just been wondering if the standard ECU would have a bit of a fit about having half its sensors and the injectors ripped out I'd need to get a later T series anyway as they have the coilpacks and the dizzy would go through my heater box otherwise lol

I do like that element of being able to play about with the ignition though... and I'm not planning to go turbo so that would simplify my job a little ;D

[sowen]

The M-series pistons cleaned up well with white spirit and scotchbright, and are far better condition than the T-series pistons I've removed, with next to no scoring on the skirt:



It still amazes me that I was able to score a cheap engine, with the better rods, and correct grade A pistons to drop straight in, and here's the difference between the two, T on the left, M on the right:



While the engine was apart, I stripped the turbo down again to replace the old heatshield, I've been meaning to do it for the last half year, one less part to loose on the shelf



The bores have been given a quick de-glaze, I'm not expecting the engine to last 100k miles, I'd be happy with a trouble free 10k miles, as I'll get bored before long and want to change it again inevitably ;D





Normally I've tried to avoid engines with cambelts, preferring timing chains as I trust those better, but in this instance the quickness that the engine can come apart and go back together does make sense:



So now all I need to do is put the exhaust and turbo back on, drop the radiator and intercooler on with their pipework, pour some oil in the sump, and wait for the postman to deliver the fuel swirl pot then I'm back on the road ;D

[sowen]

It's almost all back together now, engine runs sweetly again, but there was still some thick white smoke coming out of the exhaust so the turbo is off again while I decide whether to get it rebuilt or chance another secondhand one?

The swirl pot arrived in the post, and was given some black paint to protect the aluminium:







After a quick look in the engine bay, the only free space remaining was infront of the carbs under one of the intake pipes, so I made a bracket to bolt to the bumper iron to give a secure base to bolt the swirl pot down to:









The swirl pot was then bolted down and plumbed in:





Both fuel pumps now run quietly again, so I'm pleased with it

[sowen]

I decided to have the turbo 'core' refurbished, so sent it off, and while I was waiting for it to return, I took the downpipe and silencer lump off for a few minor 'tweaks'

I cut one side off the silencer I fabricated years ago for the twin pipe outlets, and proceeded to hack out as much of the baffling as I could get to with the angle grinder, hammer and chisel!





Not pretty, but it's now a clear run with minimal restrictions after the turbo. To make it easier to remove and modify/adapt in the future, I made some flanges and cut through the exhaust by the gearbox, then welded the flanges in and bolted the exhaust back on:



The turbo recently arrived through the post, all nice and shiny and ready to go back on:





I assembled the cold side off the car, roughly lining it up, then placed the core assembly back on the exhaust housing which was still attached to the manifold and downpipe:





Without the baffles in the exhaust it sounds a little deeper and louder now



All I need to do now is carefully run it in, trying not to glaze the bores again, but the first few drives I've done since the rebuild indicate there is little or no smoke coming from the exhaust. Time will tell what the oil consumption is.

[sowen]

The car is running well, and I found some time to try out a new camera and make some videos recently.

This one's me driving round a local lane, bashing the front valance and exhaust on the road in a few places



Here's two videos of the rear De Dion suspension working whilst driving around town. Under acceleration and braking I can see the diff is moving on the mounts, something I will investigate further at a later date. I don't think there are any issues, just the soft rubber mounts compressing and flexing but I just want to be 100% sure

[Waxoyling Lyrical]

Wouldn't this airbox restrict the airflow to the carbs somewhat? You may be better off removing the trumpets, or fit shorter ones:

[sowen]

Jul 28, 2013 11:03:43 GMT Waxoyling Lyrical said:

Wouldn't this airbox restrict the airflow to the carbs somewhat? You may be better off removing the trumpets, or fit shorter ones

That is actually the point of it, if there was an unrestricted flow of pressurised air through the carb the fuel will get blown out of the float chamber's and it would die everytime the intake goes into positive pressure .

As it is, I'm getting a good 10psi from around 1500rpm upto 6000rpm taken from the inlet manifold by the head, if there was a flow restriction from the trumpets I would have expected that to drop off higher up. The stock Mini, Maestro and Montego turbo plenums are more restrictive than mine, and they work well

[blackpopracing]

Updates?

[sowen]

Sept 11, 2013 22:38:07 GMT blackpopracing said:

Updates?

I suppose I've got enough to make an update now!

Something I've noticed is that at motorway speeds the rear seemed to feel light, so I made a small ducktail spoiler for the bootlid







It seems to have done the trick, and I like the look of it so that's all that matters

I've also fitted an intake air temperature gauge, measuring the air temps going into the plenum. I've left enough space to fit a second gauge and plumb it into the intake either at the air filter or immediately after the turbo



I've also fitted some air ducts into the bonnet, and made a seperate larger bonnet bulge that screws on top. Underbonnet temperatures do seem lower now after a run, and I've got a little more space in the top of the engine bay, as there's no more space to play with in the tiny P6 engine bay







There is a new engine to go in, but it needs a lot of work to be ready to fit, and money/time are tight now so it's on the backburner for a while. Once done it will be well worth the wait, and will have a bit of this on the side

[ChasR]

Ooooh, Supercharger power? A combination of the two or simply a change in the type of forced induction?

[adam73bgt]

The P6 is looking mean! I'm intruiged by the new engine and blower, twincharged T16?

[sowen]

Sept 12, 2013 21:32:05 GMT ChasR said:

Ooooh, Supercharger power? A combination of the two or simply a change in the type of forced induction?

Sept 12, 2013 22:07:51 GMT adam73bgt said:

The P6 is looking mean! I'm intruiged by the new engine and blower, twincharged T16?

Compound like Claymore's Volvo, it simply isn't loud enough yet

A different engine family will be used, I'm held up on the bellhousing adapter and a few other small clearance problems, but nothing major. It doesn't help that the P6 still works well, whilst I've got to bring my Discovery in for some significant body welding repairs now and my 75 is showing it's age and mileage

[claymore]

Ohh, I'm realy looking forward to the way this is going

[adam73bgt]

Ooo if it's anything like the Volvo this should be an absolute beast!

But different engine family eh?.. does this mean there will be an M16 engine going spare?... I've got a vaguely M16 shaped hole in the MG thats unfortunately filled with B series at the moment

[sowen]

Sept 13, 2013 19:25:55 GMT adam73bgt said:

Ooo if it's anything like the Volvo this should be an absolute beast!

But different engine family eh?.. does this mean there will be an M16 engine going spare?... I've got a vaguely M16 shaped hole in the MG thats unfortunately filled with B series at the moment

Not too sure what will happen yet, I have thought about relocating the engine/gearbox into another shell, stripping and caging it and using as a trackday toy, will have to wait and see...

[blackpopracing]

Twin blowers? cool!

[sowen]

Sept 14, 2013 15:09:03 GMT blackpopracing said:

Twin blowers? cool!

Compound charged

I've been gathering bits and bobs for a few years now, and have a handy little stash of bits, which are now mostly coming together, but everytime I want to devote 100% garage playtime to it something comes up and thwarts my plans

Right now I need to weld up my Disco, hoping it won't take too long to get done....