wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 19, 2015 12:03:04 GMT
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This thread is strangely addictive and its not because I dislike 911s quite the opposite.... A little treat from downunder.... 1973 Bolwell Coupe Founded by brothers, Campbell, Winston and Graeme Bolwell in 1962, this home-grown company produced some of the best sports cars ever seen in this country. Combining distinctive styling with rugged Aussie running gear, surviving Bolwells are keenly sought after by collectors today. The first model produced in quantity by the fledgling company was the Mark IV of 1963, with over 200 built in component kit form - the buyer was left to supply and choose the type of running gear and do final assembly. The low-slung bodywork was made from fibreglass, in either a gullwing hardtop or roadster styles, and the Ford Cortina 1600 the most popular choice of motive power. Although early Bolwells used a separate tubular space-frame chassis, the design was updated into a stronger, lighter (and cheaper to manufacture) monocoque on the Mark IVB. With the Mark V, Bolwell moved towards serious road car production, and Holden's six-cylinder motor became the preferred engine. Following on from the one-off sports-racing Mark VI, Bolwell's next road-going model, the Mark VII of 1966 was a more sophisticated car in every way. Following Lotus practice, the car had a backbone chassis of folded sheet metal, with suspension following the best race car practice and a very attractive fastback body strongly influenced by contemporary exotics like the Jaguar E-Type and the Ferrari GTO. The Mark VII used Holden's 186S six with either a GM-sourced three-speed manual or Triumph four-speed gearbox and with so little weight to move the Bolwell was a stunning performer, capable of achieving a top speed in excess of 200 km/h. Bolwell turned out 400 Mark VII cars between 1967 and 1972, some of them sold as complete turn-key cars from the factory but the majority sold in kit form and many of these were never completed so the rear number is considerably lower. Bolwell went on to develop the Mark VII into the Nagari, switching from Holden to Ford power and the 302-cid V8 was shoehorned under the bonnet, even building a roadster variant in later years. P.S. This is my first post from my laptop so so much easier than hand typing image tags in Safari on an iphone keyboard!!
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 19, 2015 12:06:00 GMT
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Looking at a 1979 Autocar, the cheapest 911 was £16,109 - and would generally be a lot more than this when optioned-up to a 'sensible' level of equipment. To put that into the context of the UK market in '79, a Cortina 2.0GL was only £4,831 and a BMW 316 was £5,100 (the 323i was a fairly rare beast!). Other, more mass-market sports cars of the time: Alfa Romeo 2000 GTV - £6,526 BMW 323i - £7,550 Datsun 280ZX - £8,682 Fiat X1/9 - £5,323 Ford RS2000 - £4,762 Ford Capri 3.0S - £5,574 Lancia Beta 2000 Coupe - £6,789 Opel Manta Berlinetta - £5,661 MG BGT - £5,533 Morgan Plus 8 - £8,191 Reliant Scimitar GTE - £9,343 SAAB 99 Turbo - £7,750 Toyota Celica 2000GT - £5,768 Triumph TR7 - £5,533 TVR 3000M - £7,995 TVR Taimar - £8,984 VW Scirocco GLi - £6,304 .... Very interesting where were you able to source these figures for future reference? *EDIT: Doh! Reading my own post in the quoted section I notice you said Autocar! Off to smack myself in the face...
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Last Edit: Nov 19, 2015 12:07:32 GMT by wodge
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Nov 19, 2015 23:38:58 GMT
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That Bolwell is stunningly pretty! Not a real match for a 911 though. A Marcos might just be in the same league, ISTR they were rather pricey when launched and a similar mix of sports and GT heritage.
Steve
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Steve, I think we've all agreed the 911 has no real direct rivals in all competencies. I've gone off piste and I'm just using this thread as an excuse to find old obscure sports cars! Whilst worthy of mention in this thread I'm not sure I agree the Marcos is any more a rival than the Bolwell it only had 144bhp standard from its essex v6. I would've thought the 3.3 Holden powered Bolwell was on a par. www.bolwellcarclub.com.au/ list a 15.0 quarter mile for the Mark 7 (pictured above). Marcos 3000GT Anyway you mentioning the Marcos has reminded me of a car I really should have remembered as they were built where I grew up and I used to stick my face to their factory window as a toddler. Ginetta G21 Essex V6
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Last Edit: Nov 20, 2015 9:21:37 GMT by wodge
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Whilst worthy of mention in this thread I'm not sure I agree the Marcos is any more a rival than the Bolwell it only had 144bhp standard from its essex v6. This is why being into retro cars is super... as we can now 'fix' that with a Cosworth YB dbdb : that is interesting, I've got old price guides here but didn't even think to look in them. I never realised how expensive they were. Ferrari 308 GT4 all the way for me on that reckoning. What is more on current prices the 911 hasn't shot up in price, it has been massively depressed for a long time and is now market correcting to match the other cars in its class of its era. Meaning the Jaguar XJ-S and Mercedes 450SL are bargains
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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My Essex replacement of choice would be the 2.3 Duratec on Jenveys - 305 N/A lightweight horses. Or if I wanted to go nuts maybe the Duratec V6 with a couple of blowers ala a certain Noble of this parish.
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Nov 20, 2015 10:55:21 GMT
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My Essex replacement of choice would be the 2.3 Duratec on Jenveys - 305 N/A lightweight horses. Or if I wanted to go nuts maybe the Duratec V6 with a couple of blowers ala a certain Noble of this parish. I may or may not have just gone to look at the current prices of Essex engined Marcos and TVRs as a result of your post (sadly out of my budget right now).
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 20, 2015 11:11:19 GMT
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Here's another one for you to ponder then HoTWire but this one has the Cojones from the factory with a Ford 289. 1967 Trident (TVR Spin-off) Clipper. I'm not sure this one does it for me tbh.
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Nov 20, 2015 21:25:21 GMT
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Always had a soft spot for the Ginetta, both these and the earlier Imp powered pocket rockets (Come to think of it, those have a sort of 911ish lift off oversteer habit too) I'm also very taken with the current race cars, if you watch the BTCC on ITV4, you'll know what I mean! I agree about the Trident, doesn't do it for me either, Reliant Scimitar (not GTE) at the front, side view reminiscent of Aston DBS and the rear something I can't quite place, Alfa perhaps? I Still, after all these years,and having driven more than a few, can't get my head around 911s, they are a flawed epic like the Triumph Stag, but while I can forgive the Stag and would happily own one, even my lottery list does not include Stuttgarts finest! I'm looking forward to more (and even more obscure) sports cars! the Bolwell surprised me by being something i've never heard of! On that subject, not a 911 competitor, but might I throw into the ring one of my personal favourites (and definitely near the top of the lottery list) the achingly pretty and flippin' quick Iso Grifo Lusso? Sorry don't know how to nick random pics off the net!
Steve
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 20, 2015 23:39:04 GMT
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Allow me - and I agree by the way, lovely. Thanks for allowing us to deviate from true 911 alternatives because now I can post this.... Lamborghini Islero I was lucky enough to visit the Lamborghini museum in 2013 and they have two Miuras a 400gt and one of these an Islero all stunning in their own right. Lambos after the espada(which I note is actually very relevant to thread) do nothing for me. The Countach is nasty. Lamborghini Espada
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Last Edit: Nov 20, 2015 23:40:46 GMT by wodge
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 20, 2015 23:48:53 GMT
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This one's more like the 928 than the 911 in that it was supposed to replace an icon but only ever lived in its shadow. AC 428 The convertible is far easier on the eye.
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 20, 2015 23:55:57 GMT
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Maserati Khamsin
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 21, 2015 11:22:43 GMT
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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Nov 21, 2015 11:44:55 GMT
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I know it's most likely a model but someone needs to make it
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Nov 21, 2015 22:55:34 GMT
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I drove an Espada, way back in 73 or 74, it belonged to my girlfriends flatmates boyfriend and after I spent most of a day drooling over it he handed me the keys for a run up the M4 from Bristol to Bath. After tooling along at 90 or so for a couple of minutes he said "give it some welly then" so I did! It still holds my personal record for highest speed achieved on the Queens highway, at an indicated 172 mph but I bottled out after only a mile or so at that speed -scary! The Islero is pretty and very much "of it's period" I agree the Countach and pretty much everything that followed is ugly. The Muira is also on the lottery list, nuff said! That Toyota, HMMMMM! Not sure about that, it looks like the illegitimate offspring of a 2000GT and a Suzuki Cappuchino. AC 428 is nice and reminds me of another related "sequel" car, the Shelby MkI. Also lived in the shadow (of the same legend)
Steve
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wodge
Part of things
Posts: 455
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We're at the bottom of the barrel now! 60s 4 seat with a 300hp blown 289. Shame about the looks. This was the best modded one I could find has potential with less gash wheels. A straight road, in the dark, 911 rival! Studebaker Avanti
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ToolsnTrack
Posted a lot
Homebrew Raconteur
Posts: 4,117
Club RR Member Number: 134
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Nov 24, 2015 11:31:48 GMT
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So the "mass produced" Chimaera gets no mention? Old school powerplant so usually more reliable than the Cerbera, guts of space, basically can be a targa or a convertible, handle great, and the 500 qould match it for performance.
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Nov 24, 2015 21:35:57 GMT
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The Avanti is so ugly it's beautiful! Love Studebakers anyway, hey are always at the edge of the design envelope! there was a stunning President (I think it was a President) at RRG this year.
The Chimeara, lovely as it is, is a bit new for the "up to early 90s" of the OP. Personally I love TVRs, ALL TVRs, even the unloved and unlovely Wedges. I love them for the raw power, the ridiculously lovely exhaust note and the stupid grin they bring to my face every time I fire one up (2 of my customers have TVRs) But I also hate them for the lousy finish, useless electrical system and general tendency to want to kill me! I call them "Either or cars" as in "Either your life or your licence, whichever comes first" It'll cost you one of them!
Steve
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Last Edit: Nov 24, 2015 21:47:48 GMT by carledo
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mikeymk
Part of things
'85 Polo Coupe S 1.6 16v
Posts: 931
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Nov 24, 2015 23:54:07 GMT
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The problem is that the 911 is a compact 6cyl 2+2 sports GT, the original one only had a 2.0 engine and the most desirable one only had a 2.7. Perhaps in the earlier days, anything from a Lotus Elan 2+2 through an MGC up to an XJS could be considered.
I remember an Autocar group road test of one in 1992 where it was pitched against a Honda NSX and a Lotus Esprit but the following year VW introduced the Golf VR6 and, for some customers, that was probably more a consideration than at least a used example of the former..
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Last Edit: Nov 24, 2015 23:55:45 GMT by mikeymk
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ntm
Kinda New
Posts: 3
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Admittedly not a 2+2 but frikin awesome.... 1979 Guanci SJJ1GT [a href=" "] [/a] [a href=" "] [/a] [a href=" "] [/a] [/quote]
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