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Jul 12, 2018 11:31:04 GMT
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Thanks all. The dream was to have a car storage area with a 4 post ramp to allow people to work on their own cars. The problem starts with liability and insurance. Its all just too costly. I am now investigating the container storage market. Thank you. Its so sad that due to insurance - its just not possible to start a business these days. R I don't understand your last statement regarding insurance? EVERY business needs insurance of some description. You just work that into your overheads. To be honest, you can't expect a new venture to claw back the money invested for a good few years. Do a business plan, talk to the banks. My business insurance is around £10k pa, that is for road risk, premises (3 sites), public liability etc etc etc.... HMRC will be interested in getting there pennies, business rates,tax returns etc etc. If you have a lift in there then you will need to have that inspected every year and produce the compliance certificate to your insurance. I have heard horror stories of 'mates' sharing a unit to work/store there own cars and splitting the costs, all goes well until it gets broken into or a fire occurs and no one has cover...... That's when the problems occur. I wish you every success for the future whatever you decide to do.
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As a brand new business you will struggle with trade insurance on anything Classic or performance whether you are buying and selling or just storing. I used PaceWard as a broker for two years now and they are fantastic, they cover me for performance car sales and motorsport and networking events. The insurance total for road risk and business cover equates to just over £2k. The majority of people that wish to store cars don't tend to be the super rich high value machines because those that own them have there own storage and garages. So your looking at say £10k-£40k cars. £80 a car per month round here, I live not far from you in Chippenham and vehicle storage is in high demand, 40 cars is just under £40k per year. There are extra charges you can offer on top of normal storage like battery charging, detailing, outsourcing general maintenance and servicing to a trusted trader. I run a South-West car club called Slip&Grip Automotive with 3500 members which could be of interest to you. I work with local trusted traders to offer a direct marketing opportunity to local members. We do a monthly breakfast meets at various locations and trackdays. We have a lot of members in the group looking for storage. You can DM me on here if its of interest. www.facebook.com/groups/slipandgripautomotive/I would forget about self service workshops the liability cover is an utter pain in the . I know a guy that ran one in Bristol and it wasn't a money maker even so close to the city.
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You probably should check the rates and planning situation as well: at a guess you are thinking of using empty farm buildings but your proposed use may require a change of planning and alter the business rates.
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Ray Singh
Posted a lot
More German exotica in my garage now
Posts: 1,984
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Jul 13, 2018 11:33:53 GMT
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Thank you all for your comments. They are appreciated I have read and digested each and everyone. I really want this idea to work. I have come up with some bizarre ideas over the years, but this is by far my best idea to date. I have had some success and have a man from Classic Insurance Services (CIS) coming to see me on Tuesday. He has promised me a policy that flexes on the cars i have in. If there is a single car - worth £5k i only pay insurance to protect this. If the next day we have the single car and a Ferrari 250 GTO, then the policy 'breathes' to include this. It can breath day to day, which is handy for me. I have also managed to get some interest from a chap who runs a car self service workshop and has managed to make this a successful business. I meet him on Wednesday next week to discuss. He is keen to expand to as many locations in the UK as possible. slipngripross - You have PM @grumpynorthener - You have PM
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Last Edit: Jul 13, 2018 11:35:11 GMT by Ray Singh
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I find the vast majority of people don't want to pay for anything, I would have thought Caravans or containers would be easier
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It will come in handy even if you never use it
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I find the vast majority of people don't want to pay for anything, I would have thought Caravans or containers would be easier You are quite correct the vast majority of unrealistic / unpractical / un streetwise & wet behind the ears individuals will not want to pay for anything - however the rest of the hardworking & honest classic retro owning fraternity realise that if we want something then we have contribute something for it - and I am very happy that the owners that you know don't pray upon my workshop expecting work done for nothing !
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Last Edit: Jul 16, 2018 7:27:55 GMT by Deleted
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MiataMark
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,962
Club RR Member Number: 29
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I find the vast majority of people don't want to pay for anything, I would have thought Caravans or containers would be easier I was going to suggest caravans as an alternative, although there are already quite a lot in thew area (well Bassett way). I would suggest being as flexible as you can a mix of everything might work.
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1990 Mazda MX-52012 BMW 118i (170bhp) - white appliance 2011 Land Rover Freelander 2 TD4 2003 Land Rover Discovery II TD52007 Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon JTDm
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MiataMark
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,962
Club RR Member Number: 29
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I find the vast majority of people don't want to pay for anything, I would have thought Caravans or containers would be easier You are quite correct the vast majority of unrealistic / unpractical / un streetwise & wet behind the ears individuals will not want to pay for anything - however the rest of the hardworking & honest classic retro owning fraternity realise that if we want something then we have contribute something for it - and I am very happy that the owners that you know don't pray upon my workshop expecting work done for nothing ! @grumpynorthener I think you pray that they don't prey on you
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1990 Mazda MX-52012 BMW 118i (170bhp) - white appliance 2011 Land Rover Freelander 2 TD4 2003 Land Rover Discovery II TD52007 Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon JTDm
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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I must say, I've had a similar thoughts myself. Here in Brimingham it's next to impossible to find small scale units suitable for working on one or two cars. Back where I grew up everyone had units on farms but that's no good in a city.. One thing that is quite common around here however are big empty factories and industrial buildings. It has crossed my mind that if you can get hold of a fairly large building the floor space actually comes quite cheap. You could split it up into a variety of sized units with nothing more than a few breeze block walls and rollershutter doors, easily pipe three phase in each on (on a meter of course!) Etc etc. Such setups do exist but are usually aimed towards small businesses. Makes me wonder if it could work with smaller units aimed at (or even restricted to) private use
Insurance for contents is the responsibility of the tenants obviously. Insurance of the building might be tricky but really do you even need it? If the fire was reasonably well contained, as it should be in such a setup it would probably be cheaper to repair if the worst happens than keep forking out on massive premiums every month. It's the contents that hold the value in these setups.. Liability again I'm not sure. As a landlord are you really responsible for a tenant using shared access anyway? That's all it really is small units with a shared access that you rent out to people..
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MiataMark
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,962
Club RR Member Number: 29
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Insurance for contents is the responsibility of the tenants obviously. Insurance of the building might be tricky but really do you even need it? If the fire was reasonably well contained, as it should be in such a setup it would probably be cheaper to repair if the worst happens than keep forking out on massive premiums every month. It's the contents that hold the value in these setups.. Liability again I'm not sure. As a landlord are you really responsible for a tenant using shared access anyway? That's all it really is small units with a shared access that you rent out to people.. Good idea but Yes you would need insurance, what if somebody had stored some gas bottles, fuel or similar, what if the fire spreads to the next 'unit' which just happens to have a Ferrari 250GTO in it, are you really sure that the fire couldn't travel via the roof/walls etc (e.g. Grenfell). There is a former factory in Swindon that has been converted into small business units, business centre etc. has been successfully running for years. BSS House in Cheaney Manor, there's a Land Rover spares business there.
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1990 Mazda MX-52012 BMW 118i (170bhp) - white appliance 2011 Land Rover Freelander 2 TD4 2003 Land Rover Discovery II TD52007 Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon JTDm
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Ray Singh
Posted a lot
More German exotica in my garage now
Posts: 1,984
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Jul 17, 2018 16:09:51 GMT
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Thanks all.
A friendly chap from Classic Insurance Services can to see me today - he is going to quote, but it all seems to be going ahead. He has quoted and still insures similar storage businesses in other parts of the country and can see no reason why this cannot work.
I am so excited. One more meeting tomorrow and then onto cleaning the area over the school summer holidays.
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Jul 17, 2018 17:31:10 GMT
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Hope it goes well for you, there is definately a need for storage / workshops. Here in Northumberland most of the old farm buildings have been turned into holiday homes, and you cannot use an industrial unit for car work as it makes the unit dirty!
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Smiler
Posted a lot
I no longer own anything FWD! Or with less than 6 cylinders, or 2.5ltrs! :)
Posts: 2,492
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Jul 17, 2018 17:46:00 GMT
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Following this with interest, not least because I am not a million miles from Marlbrough...
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www.Auto-tat.co.uk'96 Range Rover P38 DSE (daily driver) '71 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE 3.0ltr Jag V6 Conversion '79 Reliant Scimitar SE6A 3.0ltr 24valve Omega Conversion '85 Escort Cabrio 2.0 Zetec - Sold '91 BMW 525i - Sold '82 Cortina 2.9i Ghia Cosworth - Sold '72 VW Campervan - Sold '65 LandRover 88" - Sold
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Jul 17, 2018 19:43:00 GMT
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I notice that you're just over half an hour's drive from the Castle Combe race circuit, that might be a selling point to some.
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merryck
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 477
Club RR Member Number: 9
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Jul 17, 2018 21:19:07 GMT
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Been mulling something similar for around me but can't find the space. The plan was to have a car club based around the space, and membership based on that.
Basic membership would get you no storage, but access to the site to work on your car/be around like minded people.
If you wanted to store your car you could pay £X amount for long-term no-access storage. These cars would be at the back and notice of a good week or so would need to be given prior to removal. These are long term projects, or projects to be.
Next level would be £X++ which would be a more accessible level of storage. These cars would potentially be on dollys so they could be moved around more easily. This is the project in progress type car.
Top level would be a 'maintained' service, car would be kept charged, clean, safe and you drop an email/text a few days before you want to take it out and we'll even check the oil and fluids for you. You'd keep a file on the car, with it's MOT date, things like that and if the owner wants you'll take it down and MOT it.
Tools wise it would be heavy duty bits available, engine cranes, things that people don't usually have access to at home. They can bring their own spanners or rent the set from the club for the day. Members would also be able to bring their non-classic/retro/special cars to work on, and those of their dependents/spouse.
Once you make it a club you can have barbecues, set it up as a charity and fund raise, and try to build a community around it that will eventually be enough to sustain someone to run it properly full time.
Hope some of that helps in some way!
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Insurance for contents is the responsibility of the tenants obviously. Insurance of the building might be tricky but really do you even need it? If the fire was reasonably well contained, as it should be in such a setup it would probably be cheaper to repair if the worst happens than keep forking out on massive premiums every month. It's the contents that hold the value in these setups.. Liability again I'm not sure. As a landlord are you really responsible for a tenant using shared access anyway? That's all it really is small units with a shared access that you rent out to people.. Good idea but Yes you would need insurance, what if somebody had stored some gas bottles, fuel or similar, what if the fire spreads to the next 'unit' which just happens to have a Ferrari 250GTO in it, are you really sure that the fire couldn't travel via the roof/walls etc (e.g. Grenfell). There is a former factory in Swindon that has been converted into small business units, business centre etc. has been successfully running for years. BSS House in Cheaney Manor, there's a Land Rover spares business there. It wouldn't be my issue. It would be the responsibility of the Ferrari owner to insure their contents. When you let a premisis you have no resposnsibity to insure a tennents contents stored in it and if contents are damaged by a fire, even if it has spread from a neighbour it's still the responsibility of who ever renting to be insured no? It's a different thing to storing cars in one big space where you are offering secure and insured storage.
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Last Edit: Jul 18, 2018 2:00:27 GMT by slater
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MiataMark
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,962
Club RR Member Number: 29
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Good idea but Yes you would need insurance, what if somebody had stored some gas bottles, fuel or similar, what if the fire spreads to the next 'unit' which just happens to have a Ferrari 250GTO in it, are you really sure that the fire couldn't travel via the roof/walls etc (e.g. Grenfell). There is a former factory in Swindon that has been converted into small business units, business centre etc. has been successfully running for years. BSS House in Cheaney Manor, there's a Land Rover spares business there. It wouldn't be my issue. It would be the responsibility of the Ferrari owner to insure their contents. When you let a premisis you have no resposnsibity to insure a tennents contents stored in it and if contents are damaged by a fire, even if it has spread from a neighbour it's still the responsibility of who ever renting to be insured no? It's a different thing to storing cars in one big space where you are offering secure and insured storage. Maybe yes maybe no but you'd be in for a whole world of pain, could you be held liable because the building didn't prevent the fire spreading? If for nothing else than legal protection some form of insurance would be essential.
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1990 Mazda MX-52012 BMW 118i (170bhp) - white appliance 2011 Land Rover Freelander 2 TD4 2003 Land Rover Discovery II TD52007 Alfa Romeo 159 Sportwagon JTDm
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Jul 18, 2018 21:02:55 GMT
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Good idea but Yes you would need insurance, what if somebody had stored some gas bottles, fuel or similar, what if the fire spreads to the next 'unit' which just happens to have a Ferrari 250GTO in it, are you really sure that the fire couldn't travel via the roof/walls etc (e.g. Grenfell). There is a former factory in Swindon that has been converted into small business units, business centre etc. has been successfully running for years. BSS House in Cheaney Manor, there's a Land Rover spares business there. It wouldn't be my issue. It would be the responsibility of the Ferrari owner to insure their contents. When you let a premisis you have no resposnsibity to insure a tennents contents stored in it and if contents are damaged by a fire, even if it has spread from a neighbour it's still the responsibility of who ever renting to be insured no? It's a different thing to storing cars in one big space where you are offering secure and insured storage. If you was the land lord running the business and you didnt have an adequate fire risk assesment, fire alarm, extingishers, emergency lighting and escape routes along with evac plans etc it certainly would be your problem. Amd it would cost a lot.
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Yeh I think youre right you may have liability issues for a shared access setup. Not unsappasable tho.
I actually have a workshop in a converted factory building. The unit behind mine had a fire, luckily the damage to mine didn't extend to more than bit of sooty water ingress and a bad smell but if it had spread as far as I'm aware of have had to have claimed on my insurance, not theirs!
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60six
Posted a lot
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Posts: 1,658
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Been thinking about this myself - The cars in storage that can drive there would need MOT and insurance and sorned so then the owners insurance would help. Cars that are being held for parts or are partially built wouldnt be able to have this so they would need to be kept in a separate building and would be insured the same way a scrapyard has their insurance. Fueltanks would need draining and wheels removed.
Another thing needed would be copies of the registration document just in case of payment issues or owner untraceable.
It's possible but pricing the service is the difficult part - I guess if you get the building cheap enough it wouldnt be a problem.
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Some 9000's, a 900, an RX8 & a beetle
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