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Jan 24, 2022 13:39:25 GMT
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I think its quite scary how many people doubt their car so much they need to send to a MOT monkey to cast their eye over it every year. They arnt even allowed to check it over properly under MOT rules! What's scarier is the number of people who think they're competent enough to declare a car safe. You must have seen some of their 'fixes' - like structural panels fitted with silicone, deleting brake hoses for rigid pipe or budgie-curse word welding on steering components. They're the same people that only fixed faults because the MOT tester failed them. A disinterested inspection is always a good idea after major mechanical or restoration work.
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Jan 24, 2022 13:40:57 GMT
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I think it's also important to select your 'classic friendly' garage carefully. My dad runs a 54 plate Merc c class compressor, which is looked after by a local independent Merc specialist, and they've been great. However, before she sold it last year, my mum tried to use them for a simple repair on her 1965 mini countryman. They didn't have a clue! Can't plug it in, never had anything with points etc, we gave up and waited until the usual guys that took care of it had the time to get it in. Who said it's not what you know, but who...?
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jimi
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 1,834
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I think its quite scary how many people doubt their car so much they need to send to a MOT monkey to cast their eye over it every year. They arnt even allowed to check it over properly under MOT rules! That’s an offensive comment , the boys at my garage I’ve been using for 20 years are far from “monkeys” as you put it I quite agree, in the last 18 years the same examiner has tested my MR2 15 times, he and the other examiner that works there are far from "monkeys" I don't doubt my car, but a different set of knowledgeable eyes (and a lift) can see things I don't. It wouldn't be the first time he's taken me into the MOT bay and pointed out things that could be attended to soon and prevent future problems.
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Black is not a colour ! .... Its the absence of colour
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In reality it's probably not a major issue for the vast majority of people on this forum either way, most people seem to have a fair idea what they are doing and maintain their cars well, there is of course they people who see it as just another way of spending even less on motoring, these are the ones we need to worry about. Personally I don't bother (haven't had a car fail in years and the advisories have all been things I knew about) but I do have better facilities(4 post lift etc) than most, If I didn't I would pay for a proper safety check (i.e. remove parts if you need to etc) rather than an MOT.
The key thing if you are doing it yourself is to use a checklist, forces you to do the job properly and you can tailor it to the peculiarities your car .
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Last Edit: Jan 25, 2022 9:31:50 GMT by kevins
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Jan 25, 2022 10:34:33 GMT
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My Firenza has always had trouble getting through the emissions test, if it was a little earlier it would never have had one. I have thought of asking a local MOT station whether they'd do a non-MOT - go through the old-style MOT test form, do all the checks except the emissions, fill in the test form so I've some note that it's been looked at, but don't stick it on the computer. At his discretion, the tester can go through the motions of the official test, and abandon it at any time up to the point of recording the result, thus if one wishes to avoid recorded advisories or failures, ask before the test commences for a verbal or written list of any problems.
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slater
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 6,390
Club RR Member Number: 78
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Mot exemptslater
@slater
Club Retro Rides Member 78
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Jan 25, 2022 11:55:39 GMT
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I think its quite scary how many people doubt their car so much they need to send to a MOT monkey to cast their eye over it every year. They arnt even allowed to check it over properly under MOT rules! What's scarier is the number of people who think they're competent enough to declare a car safe. You must have seen some of their 'fixes' - like structural panels fitted with silicone, deleting brake hoses for rigid pipe or budgie-curse word welding on steering components. They're the same people that only fixed faults because the MOT tester failed them. A disinterested inspection is always a good idea after major mechanical or restoration work. Totally agree with you on the concept but thats not an MOT thats needed its a proper maintenance inspection by a competent and accountable person.. The MOT is nothing but a peice of government bureaucracy which is unfit for purpose and totally corrupt. In current form it mainly exists as a money making racket for garages! You may know good MOT testers who are intelligent well trained engineers.. (I used to use one back in Suffolk) but after 10 years of trawling Birmingham for a decent MOT establishments ive found the vast majority are either completely corrupt, clueless or just doing nothing but going through the motions of a test that makes no sense soley to feed thier families. Not only does the MOT not test for some issues it tests for a myriad of things that are irrelivent to safety. The local MOT station now has about 10 bays and works 7 days a week. Its 50quid a go and they pass anything. It's all cash in hand and the money goes straight in the foreign guys drugs bag. That's the reality of the MOT system. Its worthless as any kind of 'official' proof of anything. Worthless to a buyer, worthless as 'history' and alot of the time even the owner doesn't know if it's a genuine pass or not. I send cars with faults and they come back as a pass. I send them perfect and they find some non existent fault to fail it on. It's nothing but a box ticking exercise even for someone who knows the buisness. Until the government step up and fix it just go to your competent mechanic of choice and get a proper inspection. don't go near 'the computer'!!! You will not only get a more thorough inspection but theres no obligation to fix silly 'non faults' that may crop up. No offense intended to anyone other then the wibblepoo system. I do get rather hacked off when people put 'the MOT' up there on some kind of pedestal tho so be warned! 😂
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,714
Club RR Member Number: 34
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Mot exemptDez
@dez
Club Retro Rides Member 34
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Jan 25, 2022 12:52:26 GMT
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The truth is most MOT testers these days do not have the knowledge, expertise or training to test a car that doesnt fit into the ‘standard’ category cars post 1980 or so all fit. This is largely because most of them will never have seen anything that differs from that. Think how many modern cars they test to your one older one. But it’s amazing to see how quickly they get out of their depth on something non-industry standard.
I’ve had blazing rows with testers who have failed cars just because they don’t understand or comprehend what is being presented to them, but still won’t admit they’re wrong. The one who failed a car for a brake fluid leak on a car with mechanical brakes (he saw wet on the backplate and made an assumption- it was grease from the linkage) got reported after he refused to back down. eventually his boss told him to wind his neck in and pass it. As did the one who wasted an entire day of my time on a non-operative handbrake on a commer van- he gave it the whole ‘spends all its time parked up so the cables will be sticking’ spiel like he knew what he was doing. It wasn’t until I took it back for the retest after being unable to find anything wrong that I realised he’d been testing the wrong axle. (They’re on the front). They’re just the ones that are burned into my brain. I’ve lost count of how many times I’ve had to tell a tester what the regulations actually are for seatbelts, foglights, wipers, indicators , emissions tests, etc. because they’ve never encountered a car that doesn’t have them.
In 20 years of working on classics, I’ve only known two testers who is deem to be fully competent when it comes to older/non-standard vehicles. As slater says, If you have a vehicle older than the 80s you’d be better taking it to a competent classic specialist for a proper check over rather that relying on a MOT tester. Consider the MOT tester your GP and the classic car place a specialist consultant. One is a bare minimum coverall who can spot any major issues, the other can give you minute detail on a very specific thing.
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Last Edit: Jan 25, 2022 12:53:25 GMT by Dez
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Jan 25, 2022 12:59:42 GMT
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Consider the MOT tester your GP and the classic car place a specialist consultant. One is a bare minimum coverall who can spot any major issues, the other can give you minute detail on a very specific thing. This seems a legit approach. I've always tried to take my MOT cars to smaller local garages that I know have a) an interest in cars and b) carry out work on classics. So far so good. I took my modern to just any old place, until one place refused to test it because it was too low for their new rollers and they "couldn't do the brake test part of the MOT", which was nonsense, they just didn't know how. So then that also went to smaller local garage.
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ferny
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 984
Club RR Member Number: 13
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Mot exemptferny
@ferny
Club Retro Rides Member 13
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Jan 25, 2022 18:25:15 GMT
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I guess I'm lucky as I've been going to the same place for 10+ years and it's never cost me more then £35. They've had two locations during this time and at least four different testers on my cars there and they've all behaved the same. I think the current guy is in his 20's. Plus, mo matter what gets tested there's normally a 20 minute chat during and after. They're not specialist at all.
At least I know afterwards that my car will stop in a straight in an emergency. I'm happy to pay for that knowledge.
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Jan 25, 2022 19:07:16 GMT
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Not really the point of the thread, but a few have mentioned cost. My guy charges me £30 for a car & £20 for a bike 😀
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Jan 25, 2022 20:05:39 GMT
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Here in New Zealand wof inspectors have to be actual fully trained mechanics. Is that not the case for mot inspectors in the UK?
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mk2cossie
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 2,967
Club RR Member Number: 77
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Mot exemptmk2cossie
@mk2cossie
Club Retro Rides Member 77
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Jan 25, 2022 20:22:37 GMT
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Here in New Zealand wof inspectors have to be actual fully trained mechanics. Is that not the case for mot inspectors in the UK? Not technically fully trained. It used to be a minimum of x amount of years in the trade, and at least 21 years old (at least it was when I was trained up and tested). But the MOT system is NOT a money making system for garages. DVSA take a very dim view of places that work it that way, and they can view testing data online for each Vehicle Testing Station anyway. Theres many things I don't agree with on the testing side of things, and others that are just silly or non existent as part of the test. but construction and use, road legal and road worthy are not the same standards that the MOT test is done to
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Jan 25, 2022 21:23:47 GMT
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Depending on geographical location (in the UK) and the size and scale of the garage, the MOT test can be anywhere from slightly more than a garages hourly rate, to considerably less. The garage has to buy all the expensive testing equipment themselves (and more, and more expensive stuff every year, seems like) and pay the tester too! The rules stipulate that a test must take at least 45 minutes so a tester can't perform more than 10 tests in a typical 8 hour day. Most garages only do 8 a day to allow time for retests etc. You can't buck the system any more! I's not been a licence to print money in and of itself for many years. The only financial gain from having a testing station is the spin-off work from failures. This used to be a thing back in the bad old days where unscrupulous garages would fail EVERYTHING on spurious faults and charge silly money for "fixing" them. These days it can't happen, the computer at DVSA checks your stats and if your average fail rate climbs above a fixed percentage you get a visit to find out why and probably a good kick up the a**e! It's not a problem for me anyway, being trade, the tester KNOWS he won't get any work from failures so has no reason to make up fails or nitpick. Not that he would anyway. I pay a trade price of £30 (no retest fee) for every test, it hasn't gone up in more than 5 years. All the staff are classic car nuts, even the gaffer has a DB6 Aston and 3 E types, his son (the painter) has an MGBGTV8 and the main tester has several Rovers, a couple of MGs and a Spitfire. I worked (and tested) there myself when I first moved to the area. So we have a great relationship. They know their job inside out and back to front and classic owners from miles around flock there. It's a shame all testing stations aren't like that one!
There are always stories about mechanics arguing with testers over fails, some of them are even true! My personal favourite concerns a 72 Aussie Ford Fairmont XY station wagon that I found myself in possession of, back in the 80s Not a car I myself was familiar with, so the tester could, to a degree, be forgiven for the initial fail on excessive movement in both front upper balljoints. He showed me the play, it was there! So I parted with the massive sum of £196 (almost 2 weeks wages back then) for 2 new balljoints from Ford PIE. Fitted them and re-presented the car for retest. Only to find the new ones were exactly the same! He failed it again, despite my protests and the obvious brand new state of the balljoints. I had to trundle back to Ford PIE and buy a shop manual (another £40) which clearly stated that the balljoints are built with a massive 1/4" of vertical play in them! There was nothing wrong with the original ones! Even when shown the manual, the tester didn't want to pass it, I had to go over his head to the manager to get my ticket!
Steve
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Last Edit: Jan 25, 2022 21:50:57 GMT by carledo
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Jan 25, 2022 22:22:18 GMT
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There is a bit of nonsense in this thread when it comes to comments like ‘vosa take a dim view’, ‘you can’t do this that or the other, cos the computer says not’ & ‘it’s not worth failing a car, cos this will happen’. Let’s get real here, it’s illegal to sell drugs, does it happen? You shouldn’t engage in insider trading, do people? It’s not on for the people who run the country to tell you one thing & do another. Do they do it? If someone can feather their own nest at the expense of others, it WILL happen. They won’t all do, plenty will though, so let’s not pretend they are all squeaky clean
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Last Edit: Jan 25, 2022 22:22:40 GMT by rattlecan
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Have to agree with carledo, I too pay £30 for Mots and have done for several years, that's not enough to pay the testers wages, light the shop etc etc. Likewise the guys I use know full well that they're not going to get any work from failing stuff. Doesn't mean that I don't want it safe tho'! My grandkids are frequently in my car....
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bricol
Part of things
Posts: 285
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Jan 26, 2022 14:59:29 GMT
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If you are worried your MOT tester is taking you for an expensive repair ride, look up your local councils MOT testing centres - they quite often have their own testing facilities for their own fleets, and for testing taxis, private hire etc. They have to be open to the public, and they can't charge more than the max allowable fee as set by government - around 55 quid at the moment I think? The current system is about as good as it gets - any system is going to be open to abuse - if you think somewhere is, report 'em. Unless its gets noticed via the system checks, then someone, anyone, you, have to report it - no good moaning about it unless you do something. I've only had one MOT tester who I was annoyed about 30 yrs ago - a recently qualified one who wanted me to change the front tie-bar bushes on an Alfa 75 TS - as "they have holes in" . . . so did the new ones! But my current place, charges me 40 quid, has done for a long time, does a decent inspection, makes me come back if its something serious - which has been once in 20 years. Knows he won't get the work to fix, and has even let me use his press, ramp etc to do it on occasion. With seven cars, he does see me quite often - sometimes many times in one day
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zeberdee
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 944
Club RR Member Number: 2
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Mot exemptzeberdee
@zeberdee
Club Retro Rides Member 2
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Jan 26, 2022 17:29:59 GMT
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If you are worried your MOT tester is taking you for an expensive repair ride, look up your local councils MOT testing centres - they quite often have their own testing facilities for their own fleets, and for testing taxis, private hire etc. Very much this . They are totally independent , don’t do repairs & don’t make a profit so only charge what it cost’s to keep the doors open
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Mot exemptMercdan68
@forddan68
Club Retro Rides Member 68
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Jan 26, 2022 17:32:07 GMT
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Perhaps we could do with a list of classic/retro friendly mot garages In all our areas somewhere on the forum?? By “friendly” I mean knowledgeable and not bent 😁
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Last Edit: Jan 26, 2022 17:32:22 GMT by Mercdan68
Fraud owners club member 1999 Jaguar s type 1993 ford escort
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Jan 26, 2022 18:59:41 GMT
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Am I correct in thinking all test stations in N. Ireland are government run?
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Jan 26, 2022 20:38:00 GMT
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The golf was registered in Feb 83 so its approaching exemption, cynical me reckons that should the car not have a valid mot (regardless of exemption) then an insurance company would use that as leverage for a lower payout if it were to be crashed/stolen. So mine is still going in every year for its mot.
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