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Can't say I'm enamered with the prospect that in May the 40+'s out there will be MOT exempt. I have done a lot of research on the previous pre-60 cars and very few owners have got proof that they are 'road legal'. Now I know we could discuss how some MOTs aren't worth the paper they're printed on, but to me they are part of a cars history, and that history will stop come May this year, which is not for the better imho. I have lost count of the amount of people I've contacted that have basically run their RR on a shoestring and the fact they now don't have to spend £50 ish on an MOT is a win in their books. Means those tyres that they know are a bit low can be run for X more months, those brakes that pull to the left a bit too much can be put on the back burner etc. etc. I can see it getting to the point just like it has for me with the pe-60s - there's no point buying anything other than a project car you know is shafted and will have to do every thing to as there's a chance buying something that is 'on the road' will need to be gone over with a fine tooth comb + wallet out for spending anyway! Yes I'm annoyed by it, yes I know some people on here will disagree with me, but let's see what other angles there are on this?  |
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Rob M
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,915
Club RR Member Number: 41
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This argument has been doing the rounds for ages now. As yet, I haven't seen many pre 1960 death traps running around my local Tescos car park. I am fairly certain that I am not going to see many, if any, 40+ year old heaps of junk in a dangerous condition doing likewise any time soon. I understand that there will always be SOME owners who will purposely buy a MOT exempt car to run it as cheaply as possible and, maybe, there are already owners of cars that are soon to be MOT exempt vehicles that will use it to their own advantage but, come on now. Classics Monthly have just bought a 34 yr old XJ6 with a dangerously rotten front beam. That had an MOT, somebody issued a ticket for a car in a dangerous state. The MOT proved curse word all. We seem to enjoy making issues when there are no issues, the whole point of buying a car is to do your own checks and be certain that what you are looking at is roadworthy or not. The MOT is an indicator and, unfortunately, human nature means that not every defect will be picked up, dangerous or other wise. MOT exemption just means that you are extra careful in what you go and buy. Most MOT exempt cars are still going to remain in the hands of enthusiasts, and will be bought and sold by enthusiasts. I would be more confident in buying a MOT exempt car than a 10 year old Astra. I know which of the two would be most likely to have been poorly maintained. |
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Roach
Part of things
Posts: 717
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The owners of classics I know (including myself) are all enthusiasts, who maintain their cars very well indeed... Not sure I know anyone in the car game that scrimps, bodges or drives non roadworthy motors.
I see pro's and con's of course...... One pro being, once my Golf is running it's G40, I can just jump in it and go, straight out the shed!
Winner!
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lots of insurance companies won t insure a car pr 60 without an mot
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The owners of classics I know (including myself) are all enthusiasts, who maintain their cars very well indeed... Not sure I know anyone in the car game that scrimps, bodges or drives non roadworthy motors. of people in the car game do that - you only need to buy an old car to prove it. They're also the ones that only fix stuff(like brakes, tyres, rotten structures etc) because it's failed an MOT. And an MOT is only a basic visual inspection. Exemptions are a very bad idea. |
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Roach
Part of things
Posts: 717
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The owners of classics I know (including myself) are all enthusiasts, who maintain their cars very well indeed... Not sure I know anyone in the car game that scrimps, bodges or drives non roadworthy motors. of people in the car game do that - you only need to buy an old car to prove it. They're also the ones that only fix stuff(like brakes, tyres, rotten structures etc) because it's failed an MOT. And an MOT is only a basic visual inspection. Exemptions are a very bad idea. I didn’t say they didn’t, I said I didn’t know anyone personally. |
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I can see both sides of the argument, both have weak points. New cars are MOT exempt for the first 3 years - too many are totally neglected in this period - basic mantenance is skipped as the car will be sold / traded when the first MOT is due. A valid MOT proves nothing. Over the years I've bought at least 4 tidy cars with MOT - then found out some time later that they were unroadworthy and had been for at least a year. Some were MOT'd just a week before I bought them. Cosmetics don't interest me but many folk see a scruffy car and assume it's in a dangerous condition. I often run what look like "old bangers" but they are very well maintained. If anyone doubts how much time I spend making sure the mechanicals are 100% just have a look at my build threads. Most of the nice cars I've had all get damaged at some point (supermarket carparks etc). I just don't enjoy the hassle of fixing minor damage caused by others, so I get more enjoyment from a car when I don't need to worry if it gets scratched or bumped. The big benfit of an annual MOT is that it reminds people to keep on top of maintenance. Back to the OP - it won't make buying a car more difficult, it's already difficult due to poor/dodgy MOTs etc.  |
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NOTHING will change.......period
There will always be dodgy guys, always have, just as there are proper blokes, an mot or lack of will have FA to do with FA
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I've got a different point of view. I'm an Ex Pat Brit who was born and raised in England. In 1994 at 25 I came tot he States for six months. 24 years late I'm a duel citizen with a wife, kids and grand kid. I'm here to stay.
As many may know, each State has it's own rules for emissions and safety inspections. When I first moved here I was horrified at the state of some older cars on the road. Here in Michigan we have zero testing of any kind. When I first moved here there was annual emissions testing once a car was three years old, but that was abolished within a couple of years. There has never been to my knowledge any kind of safety testing at all. Even importing a 25 year old car all they check is that your speedo is in mph and are supposed to check your lights are correct for driving on the right, even that I know isn't always enforced as I know a guy with a Capri 2.8i he imported from the UK which still has it's Left side of the road lights, not even the little stickers you put on to correct the issue.
You often see, especially in Winter, cars with literally no rocker panels (sorry sills), massive structural rust, barely any lights working, cracked glass bouncing down the road on completely blown shocks etc. I have seen stranded cars on the roadside where rear axles have fallen out, front wheels have fallen off due to non existent seized solid ball joints etc. People must be dying in droves with these unsafe death traps all over the place right? Nope, I don't think I've ever seen an (injury) accident with one of these beaters. They often brake down, die at the side of the road, but I've never seen or heard of an accident, single or multi car, causing injuries due to the frankly appalling state of some of these cars.
When I was first here I railed against it saying it was dangerous, but most people shouted me down and said it would be an unfair burden on low income families. I don't agree that these cars should be allowed, just that curse word boxes may not be as dangerous to their owners and others as people think they will be. The worlds a funny place. The UK seems to believe that regulations are the savior of all issues where here in the US regulation and government is seen as the root of all evil. I'm not buying or selling here, just pointing out that it may not be all doom and gloom.
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"Now I know we could discuss how some MOTs aren't worth the paper they're printed on, but to me they are part of a cars history, and that history will stop come May this year, which is not for the better imho."
^ I don't see any reply so far that talks about the *** MOT history *** that I mentioned, all there is is talk of the current MOT?
You can tell a lot about a car from its MOT history, especially if it's extensive.
I could choose 5x random make RR's that are cars from 1970 and look up their history.
If that history goes back to 2005 on each car I would put money on their being at least one Fail in there.
Now chances are (hopefully) that Fail was fixed so that the car then passed its MOT within X days/weeks of the Fail.
Does anyone not see where the chances are of this all going wrong if that Fail was not picked up because the car was MOT exempt?
Nothing personal, but I wish I could spot every single defect on a car that I've bought unlike 'Roach' above.
But the reality is every single one has had at least one thing I didn't spot before I bought it! And after years of ownership, do I still spot everything on a car? Nope, I don't, but I would like to live in Roach's world where everyone that owns a classic is honest and no-one ever lies, especially those selling a car!
MOTs may not be perfect, but compared with nothing a.k.a. people I don't knows honesty, I know which option I'd take.
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Kinda rubbish though, if I gave you any one of my cars reg numbers there will be no fails. Not that any of them have ever been dangerous per sa, but moreover I have a very ‘good’ tester, you might say. He knows me & he knows I’m sound, concequently, never a single fail. The system is NOT fail safe & never will be |
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I know of one prime example of why this mot thing is a bad idea. REALLY bad. The car in question has just had its last MOT and the clutch is currently stuck. Once its freed off he will be on his merry way. The car doesnt get used from one week to the next and for the last few years hasnt had a thing done to it unless it actualy breaks. How its passed an mot for the last couple of years is beyond me, mabie crossing your fingers does actualy work.
There are plenty of genuine classic car enthusiasts out there who care for their cars, and service them regularly, but they are bound to miss something if they don't have a second pair of eyes look over their pride and joy.
Bad bad bad bad bad idea.
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Kinda rubbish though, if I gave you any one of my cars reg numbers there will be no fails. Not that any of them have ever been dangerous per sa, but moreover I have a very ‘good’ tester, you might say. He knows me & he knows I’m sound, concequently, never a single fail. The system is NOT fail safe & never will be "Kinda rubbish though"? Really? You just disregard 5x random 1970 cars that range between £1300 ish (on bids) to £9.5K and that's kinda rubbish? But all of your cars are great and you have a very 'good' tester (whatever that means) that you won't need the services of any more if you've got some 40+ year old RRs? I wish every RR owner/driver/MOT inspector was more like you. |
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Can't say I'm enamered with the prospect that in May the 40+'s out there will be MOT exempt. I have done a lot of research on the previous pre-60 cars and very few owners have got proof that they are 'road legal'. Now I know we could discuss how some MOTs aren't worth the paper they're printed on, but to me they are part of a cars history, and that history will stop come May this year, which is not for the better imho. I have lost count of the amount of people I've contacted that have basically run their RR on a shoestring and the fact they now don't have to spend £50 ish on an MOT is a win in their books. Means those tyres that they know are a bit low can be run for X more months, those brakes that pull to the left a bit too much can be put on the back burner etc. etc. I can see it getting to the point just like it has for me with the pe-60s - there's no point buying anything other than a project car you know is shafted and will have to do every thing to as there's a chance buying something that is 'on the road' will need to be gone over with a fine tooth comb + wallet out for spending anyway! Yes I'm annoyed by it, yes I know some people on here will disagree with me, but let's see what other angles there are on this? easy solution here...you see a 40+ y/o car you want to buy , ask the seller to m.o.t it .... simples!! "exempt" should be re-phrased as "optional"! its not brain science/rocket surgery. |
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'80 s1 924 turbo..hibernating
'80 golf gli cabriolet...doing impression of a skip
'97 pug 106 commuter...continuing cheapness making me smile!
firm believer in the k.i.s.s and f.i.s.h principles.
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Kinda rubbish though, if I gave you any one of my cars reg numbers there will be no fails. Not that any of them have ever been dangerous per sa, but moreover I have a very ‘good’ tester, you might say. He knows me & he knows I’m sound, concequently, never a single fail. The system is NOT fail safe & never will be "Kinda rubbish though"? Really? You just disregard 5x random 1970 cars that range between £1300 ish (on bids) to £9.5K and that's kinda rubbish? But all of your cars are great and you have a very 'good' tester (whatever that means) that you won't need the services of any more if you've got some 40+ year old RRs? I wish every RR owner/driver/MOT inspector was more like you. The point I’m making is ‘the test’ is flawed. It will make NO difference to to buying a car, end of |
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I think If a car has made it to 40 years old, its usually had a pampered life. Anything 40+ years old will probably not be a daily drive,and will be still used for pleasure only.
Also theyll be about 0.5% of the cars on the road.
A bigger problem is the mass produced shoppers/fleet cars owned by non entusiasts,and you know, the audi Q8 types who begrudge buying tyres.
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Can't say I'm enamered with the prospect that in May the 40+'s out there will be MOT exempt. I have done a lot of research on the previous pre-60 cars and very few owners have got proof that they are 'road legal'. Now I know we could discuss how some MOTs aren't worth the paper they're printed on, but to me they are part of a cars history, and that history will stop come May this year, which is not for the better imho. I have lost count of the amount of people I've contacted that have basically run their RR on a shoestring and the fact they now don't have to spend £50 ish on an MOT is a win in their books. Means those tyres that they know are a bit low can be run for X more months, those brakes that pull to the left a bit too much can be put on the back burner etc. etc. I can see it getting to the point just like it has for me with the pe-60s - there's no point buying anything other than a project car you know is shafted and will have to do every thing to as there's a chance buying something that is 'on the road' will need to be gone over with a fine tooth comb + wallet out for spending anyway! Yes I'm annoyed by it, yes I know some people on here will disagree with me, but let's see what other angles there are on this? easy solution here...you see a 40+ y/o car you want to buy , ask the seller to m.o.t it .... simples!! "exempt" should be re-phrased as "optional"! its not brain science/rocket surgery. I tried that with a good half a dozen owners and their answer was "it's MOT exempt, I don't need to get one and I won't be" or words to that effect. |
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"Kinda rubbish though"? Really? You just disregard 5x random 1970 cars that range between £1300 ish (on bids) to £9.5K and that's kinda rubbish? But all of your cars are great and you have a very 'good' tester (whatever that means) that you won't need the services of any more if you've got some 40+ year old RRs? I wish every RR owner/driver/MOT inspector was more like you. The point I’m making is ‘the test’ is flawed. It will make NO difference to to buying a car, end of Individual tests can be flawed, yes, but as I mentioned before, the MOT history is not so flawed and this is what will be ending when people don't get their cars MOT'd any more. |
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