Help me build a cost effective sound system for Woody.

[Paul Y]

Yup, Know that I am still not at the driving stage but am rapidly approaching the putting the interior and wiring in stage.

I know nothing about ICE.

It appears that a number you are well versed.

So, gather round and start putting your fingers in my wallet for a change.

For those that don't know, Woody is a 66 C10 pickup. There are already large holes cut in the doors for speakers, there is a 'grid' in the centre of the dash where the speaker would have been originally and there is a huge amount of room behind and under the bench seat.

The cab will have sound deadening added in the doors, on the floor and behind the seat.

I don't want a head unit in the dash.

My thinking is to use one of these

www.aliexpress.com/item/4000155165935.html

With some sort of amp to power two speakers in the doors, two in the dash and a base box behind the seats.

I already have some unknown brand speakers but quite happy to take advice.

Not looking to spend a fortune just want to play a few tunes when the need arrises.

Over to you.

P.

[Rich]

If you are going to run an amp then just do that with a Bluetooth receiver and cut out the middle man, that unit isn’t really needed if you were going to just feed it into an amp

[Paul Y]

I liked the ability to switch it on and off plus control the volume outside of the phone, hence the adapter thing.

Looking at the spec the adapter thing only has 2 channels hence the thinking of using an amp. As i said, I know nothing about this stuff!

P.

[braaap]

So after



You plan Woody's soundup(date) ?

Well, a few pics might help to plan a concept. I saw Your doors in the other thread, and the holes in the doors aren't really a good place for speakers. They end up very deep down (would be okay for bass speakers) and the door metal needs some good sound-deadening.

You want speakers in the dash? Or on the dash?

I can't see what aliexpress product You consider since it will not be shipped to germany, so the site does rather not show anything at all.

But as I understand You want some bluetooth connection between Your phone and an amp. Or would You consider a small headunit as long as it's not going into the dash?

I (like some other users here) have that really small chinese head-unit thing in retro chrome look,

 that does sound surprisingly good for what it costs*, but the good thing is, You can control the volume with a round knob like back in the days, not over Your mobile. And You can chose from several sources: Bluetooth, USB, SD, Aux. It is small enough to place it between or under seats or under the roof (which would be my place since the display is hardly recognizable in day light).

It would also be interesting what the space situation under and behind the seat(s) is for a good portion of bass to fight up against the expectable engine noise/vibes.

* I paid under 20€ incl. shipping for it, so should be 10-15 pounds?

[kevins]

Another one for the above, for what they cost they are suprisingly effective.

[Paul Y]

Thank you Gents.

I cant use a head unit as the space of the radio is being used for 'other things' hence why I was interested in this unit.

www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Amplifier-DAMGOO-Technique-Password/dp/B07XG33WPN



I like this as I have a spare hole in my dash and this would be an inconspicuous way of getting a control in there.

The holes in the door look like they have been made with a tin opener but they are what they are so that is where a set of speakers will have to go!



So....

from my little knowledge, always dangerous, the unit above will only be able to drive 2 speakers, hence the thinking of using at the volume control and blue tooth...thing...and then drive the door speaker, dash speakers and bass speaker from the separate amp.

The picture below shows where the grid is for the dash speakers braaap I was hoping that using these would offset the poor position of the door speakers.



As there used to be a fuel tank behind the seat it means there is a lot of room for other things, don't have the dimensions as I am away from home.

Bluetooth thing £16

Speakers - in stock

bass speaker - recommendations

Amp - recommendations

cables - recommendations

If this is right then how do I put it together, have I missed something or am I completely wrong!

P.

[thomfr]

I would recommend to use the low position in the doors for midrange and low *bass" and add a pair of tweeters or, better, a simple small combo (speaker with tweeter) in the dash positions but with a high pass filter before these so they do not have to take care for the bass.
Then a simple (not too big) bass box (with included or separate amplifier) behind the seats. And a simple head unit or 2 channel class D amplifier with BT to drive the normal speakers and a pass through to your sub. Adding some sound deadening material into your doors. That should do.


Thom

[braaap]

Jun 23, 2022 21:10:41 GMT Paul Y said:

Thank you Gents.

I cant use a head unit as the space of the radio is being used for 'other things' hence why I was interested in this unit.


I like this as I have a spare hole in my dash and this would be an inconspicuous way of getting a control in there.

Sounds like a plan and I can't say anything against this part, so I won't.

The holes in the door look like they have been made with a tin opener but they are what they are so that is where a set of speakers will have to go!

Whoever made this was lacking a proper saw or just the blade for it? Anyway, he obviously drilled a lot of holes and cut the rest but forgot to grind away those sharp edges on the upper part. You can now do that before blood flows. And since You're at it, You can consider a few more steps, see my next post.

The picture below shows where the grid is for the dash speakers braaap I was hoping that using these would offset the poor position of the door speakers.

I'm not sure here what You mean, the square holes in the a-pillar or those round holes (?) on top of the dashboard?

[braaap]

I agree with thomfr , although the wide distance between the very low positioned bass speakers and some dashmounted mids&highs would certainly be "suboptimal".

But this can be adressed. To illustrate these options I scrolled through Your build thread and found some useable pics.

Doors:

as said, the holes in the door are not the best place, but they are there and You want to use them.

Whoever placed those speakers there, did he care for the gap between the recessed area on the door metal and the surrounding tin? Otherwise there will be a gap, that prevents the speaker to be fitted correctly sealed and can even deform the speaker basket. Therefor You should do something here to bring those tin surfaces to one level. Wheather You fill up the full recessed part or just around the speaker, if You want to keep the tin/paint visible or add some wood or leather in the lower area of the door - Your car, Your choice.





But while You are at it You can consider cutting a second hole for a twin set of speakers (should be 6 or 6.5" speakers) or enlarge it for one 6x9" speaker, a typical american size. Btw. I don't know why the person who cut the holes, did them so far back, did he have ears at his feet? Or is there something hidden in the door front corners?






Front speakers:

in the 70s when Your truck was just a used car and not a classic yet, a lot of people used globe speakers maily on the parcel shelves of their saloons. Why not use them in front today?  But I wouldn't go for the 50 year old stuff, Blaupunkt makes them new again and some other brands possibly, too.

You can then chose if You want them on or below Your dashboard?





Or You go a 90s way, when so called kickboards were used in cars with no speaker places. They were custom made from  fibre glass in the corners between floor, footwell and a-pillars with speakers turned upwards to driver and passenger.




Or You could even buy something similar in form of wooden panels for cars like the vw beetle back in the 90s, would require custom parts made for Your truck.




Amps & subwoofer(s):

If You still desire more You can custom make some enclosure behind the seats (i would recommend so called shallow woofers, without a wide magnet, made for such problems) and one or two amps below the seats/bench.

[Paul Y]

Am away until Monday so will respond with some questions if that is ok braaap.

Appreciate the effort gone into the reply.

P.

[Paul Y]

Questions, questions!!!

braaap , thomfr really appreciate the replies.


The kick panels are a no go as there is a fresh air vent when the speakers would want to go and not a fan of putting 'globe' speakers on or below the dash.

Doors

Now, with regards to the doors I can make the holes a little bigger, why they are in the position they are I have no idea! There is an intrusion a bit further forward but enough room to fit a 6 x 9.

Something like this?

www.amazon.co.uk/Kenwood-Speakers-2-Way-13-cm-Black/dp/B0799CLK4T/ref=pd_bxgy_sccl_2/259-9620196-0202561?pd_rd_w=zMzqn&content-id=amzn1.sym.79b812bf-5c8b-4c0c-851c-784423adaff5&pf_rd_p=79b812bf-5c8b-4c0c-851c-784423adaff5&pf_rd_r=AHH247NAZFJPQ49ZA934&pd_rd_wg=vYffc&pd_rd_r=e59b74c7-b1a5-4ed0-a338-f885e98d829f&pd_rd_i=B0799CLK4T&psc=1

Dashboard

A much clearer picture of the grid on top of the dash



Thinking here was to put a pair of smaller speakers under here angled left and right in some sort of enclosure.

Maybe these?

www.amazon.co.uk/Alpine-SXE-0825-Car-Loudspeaker/dp/B00011FW0G/ref=asc_df_B00011FW0G/?tag=googshopuk-21&linkCode=df0&hvadid=414890237006&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8093247825069073387&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9045009&hvtargid=pla-594469609676&psc=1&th=1&psc=1&tag=&ref=&adgrpid=95385941729&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvadid=414890237006&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=8093247825069073387&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9045009&hvtargid=pla-594469609676

Amplifier.

Either this Sony one

www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-XM-N502-Stereo-Control-Plug/dp/B00FF4QSI4/ref=psdc_199616031_t2_B00IB7M1JM

Or this Alpine one

www.amazon.co.uk/Alpine-Electronics-BBX-F1200-Channel-Amplifier/dp/B00IB7M1JM/ref=psdc_199616031_t2_B00FF4QSI4

Blue Tooth receiver

Still like the look of this one.

www.amazon.com/Bluetooth-Amplifier-DAMGOO-Technique-Password/dp/B07XG33WPN

Bass!!!!

There is loads of room behind the seats for a bass box but is it worth buying a readymade under seat box?

Also this is beginning to get a bit expensive!

Thought son what I am trying to put together?

Appreciate your help.

P.

[thomfr]

Yes! The Alpine amplifier has the advantage of the high/low filter. Which would give you the before given option of only mid and high frequencies on the small dash mounted speakers and full range to the bigger door ones.
If you want to keep it simple take an under seat bass speaker with amplifier included. If you dare to go second hand (often knackered) then a separate bass amplifier with a lose bass tube can be picked up cheaper maybe locally of a kid in need of cash.
Thom

[braaap]

Should have read the title more carefully, since You only seem to plan on a very tight budget.

My suggestions were more MY approach as to make good sound from bad speaker positions. If You insist on keeping them, I would suggest to glue some wooden frame under the speaker grille in the dash and mount a pair of coax speakers from underneath.

That position was made in a time when people did not know anything from stereo and heard AM radio stations, mono sound from mono speakers. And You will hardly hear anything better from that place. The very deep down speaker places in the doors are quite pointless for mids and highs too, but okay for deeper sounds.

I'm not a fan of those underseat bass things, since they only feature small speakers in tiny boxes.
(Keep in mind, Your engine in combination with exhaust and cabin rattle will produce enough low frequencies to erase Your bass sounds from those small speakers completely). Any door has more room to give, and that's why I would rather go for 6x9s in the doors. A 4channel amp will be fine for both speaker pairs.

I'm not going to comment on Your speaker choice since I don't known them, but generally I'm not a fan of speakers from a brand that mainly produces head units and other electronic gear. It might work but some things are better left to experts.
In the end it's You who has to decide if You like the sound or not.

TBH. it might be enough if You just look for some bluetooth speaker box for Your mobile. Place it on the seat next to You or between You and a passenger, just take care of a USB power supply.

I'm sure it will not sound anything worse than a system in Your speaker positions, but with far lesse effort.

[mk2cossie]

If it were me, I'd fit some 6x9 or 16.5cm coaxial speakers in the doors, and use the centre speaker position for a 6.5 inch sub woofer

[jimi]

Jun 28, 2022 5:16:53 GMT braaap said:

That position was made in a time when people did not know anything from stereo and heard AM radio stations, mono sound from mono speakers. And You will hardly hear anything better from that place. The very deep down speaker places in the doors are quite pointless for mids and highs too, but okay for deeper sounds.

Stereo was invented in the 1930's ... way before his truck was built Google Alan Blumlein
"pedant's hat on" all speakers are mono, you need a pair for stereo "pedant's hat off"

[mk2cossie]

Jun 28, 2022 8:58:01 GMT jimi said:

Jun 28, 2022 5:16:53 GMT braaap said:

That position was made in a time when people did not know anything from stereo and heard AM radio stations, mono sound from mono speakers. And You will hardly hear anything better from that place. The very deep down speaker places in the doors are quite pointless for mids and highs too, but okay for deeper sounds.

Stereo was invented in the 1930's ... way before his truck was built Google Alan Blumlein
"pendant's hat on" all speakers are mono, you need a pair for stereo "pendant's hat off"

"Pedant"

[mk2cossie]

Paul Y how much space to you have behind the centre grill?

As my 6.5 inch sub lives in (approximately) 9 litres of ported box, up behind the glove box

[mk2cossie]

Actually, scratch that idea entirely!
Could you just build a Bluetooth speaker box with 2 speakers and a sub in one box and mount the lot behind the seats?

It doesn't solve the holes in the door, but the speakers would have something decent and non flappy to work with

[Paul Y]

Thanks again for everyones replies.

If we are going to be honest here hi fidelity super sound is not going to be possible in a car because of all the other factors that make it a car.

A friend of mine built a sound off competition winning Sierra many years ago which failed in its main purpose of being a car as if was filled with concrete to get the 'sound'...

The main purpose of Woody is to have fun, a sound system that 'bumps' is a nice to have rather than a need to have which is why I am keeping the budget to a couple of hundred pounds.

There are two huge holes in the doors so that is where a set of speakers will reside. Optimal? No. A good way to cover the holes up? Yes. braaap your suggestion of using a pair of 6x9's to help with the positioning has been taken on board and will be part of the plan. Thank you.

mk2cossie I could get a 6x9 in the dash but there would be no room to put it in an enclosure as there wiper motor resides pretty close to the screen side of the hole.

Again, listening to the advice from braaap and thomfr putting a pair of smaller speakers in the dash to take care of the top end and leave the sub optimal door speaker position to take car of the bottom and mid seems like a solution that - whilst sub optimal - would provide something I can sing along too....

I can build a small enclosure for them and angle the speakers left and right aiming towards the screen too bounce the sound back into the cab.

thomfr I had no idea that the Alpine unit I mentioned could split the sound (told you I know nothing about ICE) so looks like my thought process might actually work out.

Well, it sounds good in theory!

I could build an enclosure to put behind the seat or I could just buy a bass cannon ready made - I will see what I can find at a price.

Aaaaannnnnddddd..... if I was really going for super high end audio I would not be using bluetooth to play songs from my phone. The nice thing about the unit from Amazon is I can control the volume from a dial on the dash without having too touch my phone - hence why I am looking at that to connect and play.

In closing, the vision I have in my head for Woody is a poor mans Derelict. I want the interior to be nice, comfortable, quite -within reason- and a way to play music. I will probably spend more time with the music off!

Therefore a bluetooth speaker on the seat is not going to cut it.

Now if anybody would like to comment on my plan and tell me how to put it all together I would appreciate that just as I am grateful for everybody that spent the time to respond and share their knowledge.

Onwards!

P.

[braaap]

Jun 28, 2022 8:58:01 GMT jimi said:

Stereo was invented in the 1930's ... way before his truck was built

Thanks for that lesson, but when did stereophony make it's way into the general public's living rooms and even cars? Late 70s probably or even 80s?