Historic vehicles to be redefined

[ben711200]

Dec 20, 2010 16:52:18 GMT popuptoaster said:

thing is many vehicles are already restricted in where they can go, the LEZ for instance, or roads banning 7.5 tonners or bus lanes or one way streets, no one is up in arms about those, anyone who complains about this is liable to get told to just buy a normal car, no one is forced to run a historic as a daily, and if you cant afford a classic AND a daily driver then why is that anyone elses problem, there is no legal right to own cars.

The government will be more interested in blanket regs across europe that make enforcement easy, not whos car is historic, simple fact is sometimes you just cant afford to have the hobby you want, I cant afford to fly planes so I don't.

Difference being though, unless you have had periods of great financial success, you probably have never been able to afford to fly planes. This could be a sudden(ish) change that means that a lot of people can no longer afford a hobby and lifestyle they've always had previously.

If the proposals all roll out how we have envisaged, I think there will be ways to make the law work for you but it will come at a cost.

[e21meister]

Dec 20, 2010 16:10:15 GMT hongkongphooey said:

[There are also a lot of very rich , influential and famous people go on these rallies too.

#imagines newspaper headline about Chris Evans or Jamiroquai getting a tug in their vintage Ferraris for going 'over the limit'...#
I'm going to be a very interested 'fly on the forum wall' of some forums like the MGOC, AMOC or PVHCC etc. when this news becomes more widespread.

[hongkongphooey]

Dec 20, 2010 16:38:33 GMT PandaSelecta said:

Dec 20, 2010 16:34:21 GMT hongkongphooey said:

Or there was an emergency of some description?

Easy, when your wife is giving birth and the only car you have working is the classic, you have to ask permission before driving to the hospital

And what if you we're already out on your 'booked' route when she went into labour?

[kapri]

The info is out there just per usual, nobody reads it and puts it all together until it's happened.

[PandaSelecta]

Okay so lets get this straight, the options are........

1: Have an unmodified car on the rolling exemption = 1500kms a year, and asking permission to use the car.

2: Have a modified car which is within the 8 points system = 1500kms a year, and asking permission to use the car.

3: have a modified car which is over the 8 points = re-register the car to the current year via BIVA, and then pay road tax (highly modified 1957 A35 for example, becomes a 2010 car)

[kapri]

Basically yes, apart from there is NO definite 1500km restriction being mentioned , that's the figure that has already been given to both the EU and UK Government previously and MAY be considered . However I expect we will see the worst restrictions across Europe put forward for consideration as when has anything ever got BETTER?!

[arrocuda]

Dec 20, 2010 17:37:49 GMT PandaSelecta said:

Okay so lets get this straight, the options are........

1: Have an unmodified car on the rolling exemption = 1500kms a year, and asking permission to use the car.

2: Have a modified car which is within the 8 points system = 1500kms a year, and asking permission to use the car.

3: have a modified car which is over the 8 points = re-register the car to the current year via BIVA, and then pay road tax (highly modified 1957 A35 for example, becomes a 2010 car)

If you are right.... then as I see it the only difference between now and the future reg's is the mileage restriction in exchange for tax exemption. Surely that cannot be as there's an awful lot of guidance notes for such a simple concept. Then again.... you could be right.... these are civil servants so a paper mountain to accompany something that could be put into a single paragraph is not unreasonable! ;D

[Deleted]

so i cant change my car from historic back to standard PLG on the log book and avoid this all as it seems it will automatically get historic status.. if thats the case thats my "hobby" out the window as I do a lot of miles in the humber and the transit. last year they both did well over 9,000 miles..

[popuptoaster]

what no one else has mentioned yet is that restricting use of historic cars is also likely to devalue a lot of the more normal ones that people use as dailys, how much do you think your 29 year old car is gonna be worth if you want to sell it on?

[HoTWire]

This would play havoc with the show scene then,.. 1500Km isn't really enough to be heading across the country two or three times a year and get to local meets.

Be interesting to see what they do if you go over the 1500Km (which I guess gets checked at MOT time?) .. fine? If so, how much? If it was Road-Tax-ish in price, then... win win ... but if it is fine + points etc. then it becomes a tad more rage inducing.

Maybe we'll go all bosozoku and drive illegally modified cars around on trade plates.

[kapri]

Hotwire, sorry this info isn't up to the usual ACE standards but we felt it's something that needed getting out there for people to make their own minds up on the possible consequences but it does show what is being considered.

[kapri]

I've finally found the FBHVC report re 1500km , link below and original post now amended

www.fbhvc.co.uk/files/2008/12/fiva-report.pdf

[Deleted]

hi Ace.. top notch advice or not I'm glad its been brought out into the sunlight, I know you are trying to enterprit it and sadly I'm a bit dyslexic in some ways so can you give your opinion on the following statements to clarify it for me, I do of course understand this is only your interpretation of the current standing...

1. my car is 45 years old so it is automatically HISTORIC
2. I cant re-register my car as standard PLG and pay tax on it
3. without going the BVwotsit route I will be limited (possibly) to 1500kms a year in it

[PandaSelecta]

why oh why did the FBHVC say that

"3. Number and Use of Vehicles

• Over 70% of historic vehicles travel less than 1500 kilometres per year."

You cant tell me that just over a million vehicles in the UK do less than 1000 miles a year

[kapri]

Dec 20, 2010 18:09:58 GMT PandaSelecta said:

why oh why did the FBHVC say that

"3. Number and Use of Vehicles

• Over 70% of historic vehicles travel less than 1500 kilometres per year."

I would think there were trying to show how little impact Historic vehicles have environmentally to ensure minimal effects on the bulk of their members. I must say that ACE would always try to couch such documents in the widest possible terms as info given can be used against you.

You must remember that FBHVC cut lose daily drivers anyway, as we reported

www.the-ace.org.uk/classic-vehicles.html?searched=FBHVC+daily&highlight=ajaxSearch_highlight+ajaxSearch_highlight1+ajaxSearch_highlight2

[PandaSelecta]

Where did they get the figure though, as i cant imagine they asked every classic car owner (i know they didnt ask me)

[kapri]

Dec 20, 2010 18:05:56 GMT @rottie007 said:

hi Ace.. top notch advice or not I'm glad its been brought out into the sunlight, I know you are trying to enterprit it and sadly I'm a bit dyslexic in some ways so can you give your opinion on the following statements to clarify it for me, I do of course understand this is only your interpretation of the current standing...

1. my car is 45 years old so it is automatically HISTORIC
2. I cant re-register my car as standard PLG and pay tax on it
3. without going the BVwotsit route I will be limited (possibly) to 1500kms a year in it

Yup, that's how we see it currently. I'll repeat opinions may vary but we have tried to put as much of our info as possible so readers can make up their own minds.

[kapri]

Dec 20, 2010 18:19:13 GMT PandaSelecta said:

Where did they get the figure though, as I cant imagine they asked every classic car owner (i know they didnt ask me)

They contacted all their member clubs across the EU in a huge survey. I remember seeing the info as a friend of mine is a member of a Preservation Society.

Totally off topic put that reminds me of a story told to me about Lord Montague , when he put a stop on Andy Saunders chopping a Rolls as an exhibition at Beaulieu ( before Andy chopped his own Bentley ) . He said " We are into preservation not desecration ".

Lord Montague is the president of FBHVC.

[kapri]

Dec 20, 2010 18:19:13 GMT PandaSelecta said:

Where did they get the figure though, as I cant imagine they asked every classic car owner (i know they didnt ask me)

As an aside we have quite a few relative figures we have put together . The bulk of cars using Historic classification are those which could be used as daily drivers ie mid 50's onwards.

The rate of NEW Historic registrations has been around the 5000 per annum for the past 5 years. These would be imports and barn finds .

[Rubicon]

My question would be WHO is going to enforce this?
and i mean person,
it would take soooo long and soooo much more paper work,

but i guess theyd get soooooo much more money!
any one for a riot???