niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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OK, I need a little advice.
This morning I was driving at 60mph on a 70mph dual carriage way. I pull into the slip road for a petrol station, I apply the brakes, and instantly the wheels lock up and the car starts sliding at speed towards the forecourt. I manage to control the skid and slow down to about 30mph by pumping the brakes, but with virtually no control over the steering I plough into the curb of the grass verge, before spinning out of control to the other side of the petrol station. The TCA is completely bent, alloy buckled and probably killed the tyre. I haven't had a proper look yet to see what other damage was done.
Surely a slip road off a 70mph road into a petrol station should be properly gritted? It was literally sheet ice for the entire length, and people were struggling to fill up their cars and walk in to pay without falling over on the ice!
Is there any way that I can claim the money to get the car fixed? If there is what is the process? I took pictures at the scene, we think it might be on cctv and we reported the dangerous conditions to the police, although we didn't actually report the accident as no one was hurt and we limped the car into a parking space.
Should we go through insurance and let them sort it out, bear in mind I really don't want to lose any no claims. Or do we fix it ourselves and go through a compensation company? I was definitely not at fault, well under the speed limit and leaving plenty of time for breaking distance even in slippery conditions, in a car with good condition tyres and steering. Surely that is negligence on the part of whoever is responsible for ensuring that a 70mph slip road is gritted in temperatures well below freezing?
Luckily my friend and I were fine and we didn't hit anyone or anything else. The car should be fixable and it's just a dull as dirt Corsa, but I can't help feeling a little curse word off that Em and I are going to have to fork out several hundred pounds because of a perfectly avoidable accident.
Thanks in advance
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,834
Club RR Member Number: 174
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IIRC, if they had gritted it and you crashed you can claim. If they haven't you cant. We used to not grit the car park at Halfords for the same reason, if you cleared it it becomes the companies responsibility if somebody crashes/falls over.
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niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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IIRC, if they had gritted it and you crashed you can claim. If they haven't you cant. We used to not grit the car park at Halfords for the same reason, if you cleared it it becomes the companies responsibility if somebody crashes/falls over. That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Surely it should be the other way round? If it's properly gritted, you have taken reasonable steps to ensure safety, if you don't grit it then it's negligence?
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Last Edit: Jan 4, 2015 15:55:48 GMT by niwid
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v8ian
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,758
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I think any 3rd party insurance company will deny any liability, even if you were driving at 10mph, they will say you were driving too fast for the conditions.
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Last Edit: Jan 4, 2015 15:56:26 GMT by v8ian
Atmo V8 Power . No slicks , No gas + No bits missing . Doing it in style. Austin A35van, very different------- but still doing it in style, going to be a funmoble
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stealthstylz
Club Retro Rides Member
Posts: 14,834
Club RR Member Number: 174
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If you don't grit it then its an act of god. God's a curse word.
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niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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If you don't grit it then its an act of god. God's a curse word. Insurance companies and councils are curse word
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Sounds like you were driving to fast for the conditions
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Hi, this is all harsh but true. If you don't want to harm your no claims, don't make a claim. In the case of a single vehicle incident you will be deemed to be at fault. Think yourself lucky you didn't hit a lamp post or the armco, otherwise the highways dept could claim against you for the damage to it.
Colin
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Sorry, but I would say as well "No chance"
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niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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Sounds like you were driving to fast for the conditions In the slow lane at 60 mph, on a 70mph road, much slower and I'd have been a danger to other cars that were ploughing along at 90 despite fog. The slip road was probably 100m or more long, and I would have been doing about 55 by the time I was in it. I was anticipating the odd patch of ice here and there, I wasn't anticipating over 100m stretch of pure sheet ice on a 70mph dual carriage way
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Dez
Club Retro Rides Member
And I won't sit down. And I won't shut up. And most of all I will not grow up.
Posts: 11,712
Club RR Member Number: 34
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you were at fault for assuming a road 'should' be gritted. they don't grit roads so you can tank along at normal speeds despite it actually being icy, you are supposed to drive to the worst case you could expect in any given conditions, or deal with the consequences. if it is actually gritted, you should take that as a bonus that they are looking out for your safety. its becuase of this i honestly don't think any roads should be gritted, as in many scandinavian countries. firstly it makes people think twice about going out in such conditions at all, then if they do it is expected they will be properly equipped (snow tyres/chains, and recovery equipment) and drive with due caution, unlike what happens here currently.
moreover, i would expect that a sliproad into and out of a privately owned service station doesn't constitute part of the public highway, meaning it wouldnt be the councils responsibility to grit it, and as matt says, i don't think youd get very far trying to sue a private landowner for dangerous conditions on their land.
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Last Edit: Jan 4, 2015 16:49:54 GMT by Dez
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v8ian
Posted a lot
Posts: 3,758
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Just thinking a bit more, Report the accident to the police, although nobody was hurt or property damaged other than your car, The reason I say that, a few years ago, my son bent his clio, no other person involved and nobody hurt, he limped home and left it at that, 9 months later he received a summons for failure to report an accident, and got 6 points, report it to the police, just to be safe,
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Atmo V8 Power . No slicks , No gas + No bits missing . Doing it in style. Austin A35van, very different------- but still doing it in style, going to be a funmoble
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niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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Sorry, but I would say as well "No chance" I'm starting to think that too now.
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niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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you were at fault for assuming a road 'should' be gritted. they don't grit roads so you can tank along at normal speeds despite it actually being icy, you are supposed to drive to the worst case you could expect in any given conditions, or deal with the consequences. moreover, i would expect that a sliproad into and out of a privately owned service station doesn't constitute part of the public highway, meaning it wouldnt be the councils responsibility to grit it, and as matt says, i don't think youd get very far trying to sue a private landowner for dangerous conditions on their land. It certainly seems that way with the info I'm starting to get. Slowing down much more could have just as easily caused an accident due to lots of knobbish drivers tanking along at 80 or 90 behind me. So that's now 4 cars in my possession or joint possession that don't work.
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niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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Just thinking a bit more, Report the accident to the police, although nobody was hurt or property damaged other than your car, The reason I say that, a few years ago, my son bent his clio, no other person involved and nobody hurt, he limped home and left it at that, 9 months later he received a summons for failure to report an accident, and got 6 points, report it to the police, just to be safe, Thanks for that. Just called them on that basis and they said they only need to know if someone is injured, road furniture is damaged or it's an immediate hazard to other road users. Still better safe than sorry. Did your son bend a bollard or something? They might have been in touch because of that I guess
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You could try to claim off god but other than that you've probably got more chance of peeing into a gail force wind without getting wet, it reads to me like driver error
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Last Edit: Jan 4, 2015 17:04:09 GMT by fordperv
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Slowing down much more could have just as easily caused an accident due to lots of knobbish drivers tanking along at 80 or 90 behind me. Hi, then it would have been their fault and you could have claimed against them Colin
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,191
Club RR Member Number: 170
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I think Dez has a point (I certainly have been trying to keep a large gap from most things, even with Winter tyres on!) but I think you have a point as well Tim. Bad luck mate . On the plus side at least Corsa Spares are cheap. A TCA cannot be more than £30 and I am sure a wheel with another tyre can be sourced cheaply. That is assuming nothing else is bent or broken (aka; track rod arms or steering rack).
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niwid
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,743
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Slowing down much more could have just as easily caused an accident due to lots of knobbish drivers tanking along at 80 or 90 behind me. Hi, then it would have been their fault and you could have claimed against them Colin This is true, but it wouldn't matter if someone was injured. This whole thing ended pretty well considering how bad it could have been if there were more people in the forecourt, I don't think someone going into the back of me at speed would have been any better, unless having a bit of extra cash in my pocket while being taken to hospital on a spinal board is better. It looks like we're just going to have to bite the bullet and fix it. It's an utter nightmare as our daily 205 has just given up the ghost and we've had to scrape some money together from relatives to buy something modern and boring so Em can get to work while we have nowhere to fix cars. It turns out this modern Corsa has a huge leak, dodgy electrics and a broken rear seat, so we were having to fix it anyway. Now it's off the road needing further money and time spent, neither of which we have so I'm gonna have to borrow money from my little brother. I can't get it back to mine to work on it (60 miles away) without spending a fortune on a transporter so it's gonna have to go to a garage. All this while we're struggling to pay the rent and recovering from the xmas money binge. Meeerrrrgghhh what a few days
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ChasR
RR Helper
motivation
Posts: 10,191
Club RR Member Number: 170
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If the insurance is affordable and you need a reliable daily come summer time LMK Tim. There is a good chance that I shall be selling my E36 and putting the RST onto daily duties, at least until winter comes next year.
[/shameless plug]
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