Retro Rides Podcast #4 "Built Not Bought" : Now Live

[HoTWire]

Hello

Simon and I are planning to record another podcast, we'll start with a theme of "Built Not Bought", so do you have an questions about that or anything else to do with the forums, or cars, or stuff?

And here it is :



Or in super Audio (and downloadable) form : shoutengine.com/RetroRidesPodcast/

Or wait for iTunes to update and get it from there.

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[sb]

Feb 18, 2016 13:54:24 GMT HoTWire said:

Hello

Simon and I are planning to record another podcast, we'll start with a theme of "Built Not Bought", so do you have an questions about that or anything else to do with the forums, or cars, or stuff?

Where do you personally draw the line? For some it's about buying a finished car, to others it's about outsourcing work and you should build every inch.

Also do you have a crazy build in your head atm? I know I personally have different ideas every week, aka 4wd kanjo k10, rotary fr 911 (for the tears from owners) or currently an electric space framed kart (think ariel atom x tesla).

[hillbilly]

^^^^^^yep, that's what I would have asked.

[fuldatramp]

Great I'm loving the podcasts at the moment,

what I'd really like to know is, whats your opinion is on built vs bought? Built seems to be the main ethos of this forum and I fundamentally agree, most things are simple and self explanatory and often being brave enough to try is the biggest obstacle in a job. I have a healthy amount of respect for the cross section of engineers on here who go out of there way to make things work, and make them work well. On the other hand I've seen threads which have been flamed into the ground when someone has repaired something a way that someone else wouldn't. Surely being built rather than bought means that there are no formal standards and I'd of thought it could encourage amateurs to have a go? But when trying something new, mistakes can often be made. There have been several cases in the press where a vehicle had been badly maintained/repaired and it has caused damage to occupants and the public (for example the landrover that crashed into the river with mismatched calipers, and the vw? That had home made air ride on the front suspension that failed, the car stopped and someone drove into the back) Like the old adage 'jack of all trades, master of non' how far should people go when it comes to building rather than buying? Should there be more checks in regards to building? And what's your opinion on the IVA test?

[Deleted]

Is people paying others to restore cars, for then to try selling them again at outrageous prices ruining the hobby? Personally, its a clear YES

[PhoenixCapri]

I guess the future of 'built' would be interesting - increasing number of IVAs? Will more people start to do IVA signed off builds as they become more and more common. Do we as a group have to embrace the IVA to ensure they hobby survives (in the UK), and indeed should we celebrate the fact that unlike a lot of the world, the UK can legally build some radically modified/one off vehicles?

The other thing that'd really interest me is where you guys feel the sweet spot is? I generally live in the built camp, building cars from a bare shell, but I have to say that in general the best entertainment value cars have been ones that I've bought and only played with a bit. After all, if you spend years building a car it can be very hard to get enough enjoyment from driving it to offset all the hours spent with it just sitting there. I know the build process can be very enjoyable (I guess that's why I keep doing it) but nothing really beats actually driving a car, especially if you get lucky with the weather, traffic and road.

[surprisingskoda]

Is the stigma or perception of "built" or "bought" fair, either positive or negative aspects?

Should a enthusiast aim to do as much as possible themselves or can someone be an enthusiast without doing so?

How much must you do to be "built"? How is buying a turbo kit with all the pieces provided and fitting it (meaning "built" to most) any better than paying someone who knows what they are doing to fit the same kit, or to fabricate one for the car ("bought")?

And other similar questions about peoples reactions and values to the built or bought argument nonsense.

[HoTWire]

surprisingskoda Thanks for the questions, we recorded the podcast yesterday afternoon, I literally just finished editing it. I think we answered all your questions though.

I'm hoping people enjoy it, listening back to do the editing I think it is our most entertaining one yet.

Should be online today, I was going to record an intro, but I think maybe for the ones where it is rmad and I discussing stuff an intro isn't needed, so I'll keep the intros to just the ones where we are interviewing someone.

[Deleted]

How do you see built vs bought. For me built is the owner having input into every aspect of the car they want not necessarily actually doing all the work themselves . having worked on cars that people have done all the work and not really knowing how to some parts of it it can and is sometimes a very dangerous thing . For a built car it has to be the owners vision anything less is a bought car

[HoTWire]

Feb 24, 2016 10:00:57 GMT nightmaresracing said:

How do you see built vs bought. For me built is the owner having input into every aspect of the car they want not necessarily actually doing all the work themselves . having worked on cars that people have done all the work and not really knowing how to some parts of it it can and is sometimes a very dangerous thing . For a built car it has to be the owners vision anything less is a bought car

Without spoiling the podcast (in which you get a mention actually), you and I are aligned on that I think

[Deleted]

lovin the podcasts . I don't post on the forum much these days as the scene has moved a little for me over the last few years and is less relevant to me but I do still check in and have look now and then keep up the good work

[nalesutol]

I don't think you can draw a line as the grey area is enormous.

Take my build as an example. I would consider it is in the built camp. However, I had the engine built (to my spec),the chassis modified (to my requirements), the roll cage fabricated (I was there helping/designing/making tea every day), suspension parts made and modified to my spec and various aluminium parts fabricated (again, to my spec). In fact, the jobs that I felt I wasn't competent to do myself.

However, no one else has touched the car other than me. I have bolted everything on. I have also done all the fibreglass and carbon bodywork and made numerous parts on my lathe and CNC mill. If I couldn't make it I took my designs to someone who could.

Does this make my car built, bought or somewhere in between? I think that this is an unanswerable question as it depends solely on the individual's experience and opinion.

However, I don't like people who bask in the reflected glory from other people's skilled workmanship.

[hillbilly]

Great to listen to as always, keep them coming!

[jifflemon]

An interesting listen - looking forward to the next

Totally agree with this:

Feb 24, 2016 23:00:41 GMT nalesutol said:

However, I don't like people who bask in the reflected glory from other people's skilled workmanship.

Buy that 100k Cossie and please, bring it to shows. One of my pet hates are people turning cars into expensive ornaments - USE THEM PEOPLE! However, when you do turn up at the show, for love of all that is holy, be honest. I don't care if you just bought it and love it.

I've zero issues with "bought". As many people have pointed out, more and more skills will have to be "bought" with IVA becoming more common although I'd be more concerned about the law stating anything pre-60's doesn't even require an MOT now! Where's the next Boom market?

The problem I have with the re-selling of cheap cars, is that it's ultimately leading to fewer cars. That £250 car that I stupidly paid £1500 for before realising just how much work was involved in restoring it, is going to sit languishing somewhere, slowly getting worse because I need to get my £1500 backplus a bit of profit. By the time I've going to let someone give me £250 for it, its beyond saving. So the person now buying it to break will want £250 for the first panel they sell. Ever wonder why prices for parts are going up?

Maybe I'm the fool, but the last time I broke a car, it was gone in a 2 weeks, because everything - EVERYTHING - was priced at £5 plus Postage (or collect). I was in profit, admittedly, not "one day Rodders..." Profit, but not out of profit.

Ever wondered why that cossie is 100k? The basket case ones are 5k. No-one wants to pay for restorations costs. No-one makes parts without a "group buy" and few people can afford that group buy because they've wasted money on the initial purchase price.

[fuldatramp]

Woooo, I'm famous, a real life mention in a gen-u-ine pod cast! Thanks for airing my question and answering, I'm enjoying these podcasts? What's the next subject?

[duncanmartin]

I really enjoyed this podcast (and all the others).
As someone with the skills to sort bikes, but no space or talent for working on cars, I pay someone to sort out my car. But I bought all the stuff (wheels, suspension etc) that was fitted. I guess that's somewhere in the middle of the built/bought continuum. It's the only way I'll ever roll the car I want, so it's how it has to be, and while I love watching the threads where some skilled guy/gal takes some pieces of metal and turs them into an awesome car, I refuse to feel lesser because I didn't put my car together with my 2 hands.
You do need to work out how to end a podcast though.

PS I forgot to say that you can afford a Porsche. It will just have to be one with the engine in the front!

[HoTWire]

Feb 28, 2016 10:27:46 GMT fuldatramp said:

What's the next subject?

Might tackle "What is Retro?" ... I really want to get an interview under our belt too, so I'm going to try and sort out my audio stuff so I can do that ASAP.

[dbizzle]

Feb 29, 2016 16:43:48 GMT HoTWire said:

Feb 28, 2016 10:27:46 GMT fuldatramp said:

What's the next subject?

Might tackle "What is Retro?"

*buys popcorn*

[surprisingskoda]

Feb 29, 2016 16:43:48 GMT HoTWire said:

Feb 28, 2016 10:27:46 GMT fuldatramp said:

What's the next subject?

Might tackle "What is Retro?" ... I really want to get an interview under our belt too, so I'm going to try and sort out my audio stuff so I can do that ASAP.

Where is that old member that raced capris from the states? His name escapes me right now. Would totally listen to an interview with him!

[Deleted]

good pod cast again. I think you guys covered it well and I found myself talking along with you on some of it . what i boils down to i think and i hope most would agree really is that its ok to have your dream car built by various different people without you even getting your hands dirty because maybe you don't have the time or skills . it would still be classed as built because its your dream car nobody else's its build to how wanted it built but credit must be given accordingly. What i think is not accepted are cars that are bought and the owners make out that it was all their idea without giving any credit to who ever did actually build it . Having stuff done on a car because you don't have the knowledge to do a particular job is nothing to be ashamed of, in fact I wish a lot more people would admit they can't do some stuff and get skilled people to do it for them, then the modified car world would be a much better and safer place if they did.