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Feb 27, 2014 21:16:15 GMT
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...and I seem to recall reading t'other night that the new BMW Mini has an extra 4" in the wheelbase. Sheesh : how do they still call it a Mini?
Then again, I remember 25 years ago when headroom was a deciding factor in car choice.
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Clement
Europe
ambitious but rubbish
Posts: 2,095
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Feb 27, 2014 21:32:50 GMT
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Nuff said.
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omega
Posted a lot
Posts: 1,060
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Feb 27, 2014 21:36:42 GMT
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A photo of my Mini 35 and my BMW Mini. When I brought my BMW Mini I was chatting to the sales woman and she said the Mini is the same size as a Ford Focus (Mk1 at the time I think) but the Mini has hardly any boot space or rear leg room. Dunno how they managed that!
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Last Edit: Feb 27, 2014 21:37:51 GMT by omega
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Feb 27, 2014 22:32:21 GMT
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...my Cadillac, this huge monstrosity at 21ft long with a V8 under the bonnet - is a foot longer and the same width and 6 inches lower than the 2 litre diesel Insignia... This implies that the Insipid is twenty feet long... ;-) hmm, they are big, but... well, whatever the length, there is only a foot in it. When I look at Porsche 991's they look massive compared to mine old 911 , not much bigger in reality though. 1013 991 Wheelbase 96.5 in (2,451 mm) Length 176.8 inches (4,491 mm) Width 71.1 in (1,806 mm) Height 50.9 in (1,293 mm) 1987 911 Dimensions Wheelbase 2,211–2,268 mm (87.0–89.3 in) Length 4,290 mm (168.9 in) Width 1,700–1,780 mm (66.9–70.1 in) Height 1,300–1,310 mm (51.2–51.6 in) That's probably a good example of how a car does not need to grow - 8 inches longer and 1 wider, and I should think just as spacious (or lack of), more comfortable, twice as powerful (but half as pretty) - and look to be about the same height too.
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Feb 27, 2014 22:45:27 GMT
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Interesting thread. We must remember though that all the moderns have a lot more crash protection and that has to fit somewhere!
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Peugeot 307sw - Suzuki SV650S - MX5.
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luckyseven
Posted a lot
Owning sneering dismissive pedantry since 1970
Posts: 3,839
Club RR Member Number: 45
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Feb 27, 2014 22:57:50 GMT
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This is a great thread, although in the interests of perspective, it's not an exclusively modern vs retro phenomenon. For example, anyone who's ever watched the downright bizarre spectacle of original Minis sharing the same trackspace with truly gargantuan Galaxies in the same race division at the Goodwood Revival will be able to attest... * photo shamelessly stolen via Google, sorry unable to attribute
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Then again, I remember 25 years ago when headroom was a deciding factor in car choice. That is a good point! I don't hear people moaning about that any more and it used to be a common issue.
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'03 Porsche 996 C2 3.6 - Sort of Retro '84 Porsche 924 - Definitely Retro!
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Feb 28, 2014 17:44:32 GMT
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We are doing indecent thinks with your fred, but....again not quite what you had in mind, but holy smokes.....
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That's not fair though, that Lotus was ridiculously low, even when it was new!
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Rich G
Posted a lot
Keyboard Worrier
Posts: 1,059
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AB car pix
Posted a lot
Car mag' snapper
Posts: 1,337
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I remember in the early 90s my dad's Sierra Sapphire looked positively large compared to most cars in a car park. These days my Saph looks tiny beside even the average supemini! The Volvo 700/900 series do have the most astounding steering lock, hence why they are great for drifting and city driving!
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1979 Chrysler Horizon 1.3 GL 1980 Ford Granada 2.8 Ghia 1985 Ford Sierra 3dr 1985 Ford Escort Mk3 1988 Ford Sierra Sapphire Cosworth 1989 Ford Escort 1.3 Popular 1995 Volvo 960 1996 BMW 525i 1998 BMW 323i 1999 BMW 530d 2003 BMW 530i . www.facebook.com/ABCARPIX
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simes
Part of things
Posts: 734
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I was just about to link to that thread - I've got some photos on there already!
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Simes
205Mi16 - 262 cams, Jenvey Throttle Bodies, Emerald managment blah blah...... E91 320D MSport Honda NC30 Vespa 300GTS
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My old E23 next to a new 7 series
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Interesting thread. We must remember though that all the moderns have a lot more crash protection and that has to fit somewhere! This is the main reason. The ECE etc regs mean that a door has to be X mm from your hip for side airbag deployment, then the roof has to be Y mm from your head for roof airbag etc etc. Pedestrian Protection stuff dictates radii for bumpers, the gap between the top of the engine and the bonnet. And so it goes on. Basically small cars have got bigger to accomodate all that, so the next one up in the range grows and so on.
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1982 Mercedes 280TE
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MK2VR6
Posted a lot
Mk2 Golf GTi 90 Spec
Posts: 3,328
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Interesting thread. We must remember though that all the moderns have a lot more crash protection and that has to fit somewhere! But that´s no excuse for a trend that´s around for a few years, that might have started with the bmw 1 series maybe? Very high doors in comparison to the height of the windows resulting in an uncomfortably narrow interior. And I guess it was volvo´s c30 later joined by the new scirocco, who started a trend in car design to have a quite large car but make the interior unnecessarily narrow by taking back the c and d pillars from the outer edges (sorry, wasn´t sure how to put it in words...)! And this is no longer only a "design thing" for sporty/leisure cars. It gets more and more common as most designers today only tend to copy each others ideas. I see your point. However, looking at the narrow glass height of the 1 series gives the effect of a roof chop - something many custom car owners have done on their cars over the years. I personally like the high waistline and lack of height of the glass. As for the style of the back end of the Ovlov and 'Rocco, again you aren't wrong. However, the 'Rocco looks great (in my opinion). If we all wanted 'sensible', we wouldn't be on here in the first place. Yes, moderns are supposed to be sensible, but there are many things about current design features which I personally like. There are also many which are total curse word, but that's by the by.
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Smiler
Posted a lot
I no longer own anything FWD! Or with less than 6 cylinders, or 2.5ltrs! :)
Posts: 2,492
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Interesting thread. We must remember though that all the moderns have a lot more crash protection and that has to fit somewhere! This is the main reason. The ECE etc regs mean that a door has to be X mm from your hip for side airbag deployment, then the roof has to be Y mm from your head for roof airbag etc etc. Pedestrian Protection stuff dictates radii for bumpers, the gap between the top of the engine and the bonnet. And so it goes on. Basically small cars have got bigger to accomodate all that, so the next one up in the range grows and so on. I hadn't really given it that much thought before but that does make a lot of sense. One thing that doesn't make so much sense mind is why the 'Sport' variant has now become a trim package which has seemingly taken over from the 'Ghia' and is now loaded down with electric windows, memory seats, stereo, air-con, fog lights, power steering etc...
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www.Auto-tat.co.uk'96 Range Rover P38 DSE (daily driver) '71 Reliant Scimitar SE5 GTE 3.0ltr Jag V6 Conversion '79 Reliant Scimitar SE6A 3.0ltr 24valve Omega Conversion '85 Escort Cabrio 2.0 Zetec - Sold '91 BMW 525i - Sold '82 Cortina 2.9i Ghia Cosworth - Sold '72 VW Campervan - Sold '65 LandRover 88" - Sold
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One thing that doesn't make so much sense mind is why the 'Sport' variant has now become a trim package which has seemingly taken over from the 'Ghia' and is now loaded down with electric windows, memory seats, stereo, air-con, fog lights, power steering etc... Apart from the memory seats and fog lights, everything else you listed has been standard fitment on base model cars for years! I guess it's because people still want their cars to look 'sporty', but the majority of the market doesn't want stiff suspension. To be fair, there have been 'sports' trim kits for decades. Eg, in Australia the GTS spec on Monaros was a trim pack and could still be had with the 186ci six cylinder, similarly the RS 'Rally Sport' pack on the Chevy Camaro was only a trim pack with wheels, headlight covers etc. Both of these examples are from the 1960s, so I wouldn't call it a new phenomenon.
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One thing that doesn't make so much sense mind is why the 'Sport' variant has now become a trim package which has seemingly taken over from the 'Ghia' and is now loaded down with electric windows, memory seats, stereo, air-con, fog lights, power steering etc... Apart from the memory seats and fog lights, everything else you listed has been standard fitment on base model cars for years! I guess it's because people still want their cars to look 'sporty', but the majority of the market doesn't want stiff suspension. To be fair, there have been 'sports' trim kits for decades. Eg, in Australia the GTS spec on Monaros was a trim pack and could still be had with the 186ci six cylinder, similarly the RS 'Rally Sport' pack on the Chevy Camaro was only a trim pack with wheels, headlight covers etc. Both of these examples are from the 1960s, so I wouldn't call it a new phenomenon. Believe it or not base spec stuff in the UK still comes without things like electric rear windows! e.g. the Vauxhall Astra and Insignia come with Front only on their base spec. I don't think there is anything on sale in Aus with front only these days. The Aus market has a very high expectation when it comes to "base" spec cars, so we get stuff here that other markets only have on level 2 or 3 vehicles.
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1982 Mercedes 280TE
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mudpud
Part of things
Posts: 109
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I would take the green one any time the other is Pig ugly!Not my taste or colour at all.
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